Wikipedia talk:Vital articles/Level/5/Arts and everyday life

General Level 1 Level 2 Level 3 Level 4 Level 5

Level 5 Subpages

People History and geography Arts and everyday life Society STEM

Introduction

The purpose of this discussion page is to select 50,000 topics for which Wikipedia should have high-quality articles.

Any article currently on this list may be challenged. The discussion is open to the following rules:

Voting count table (>60%)

P = passes F = fails		opposing votes
		0	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	9
0	supporting votes	–	–	–	–	F	F	F	F	F	F
1		–	–	–	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
2		–	–	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
3		–	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
4		P	P	P	F	F	F	F	F	F	F
5		P	P	P	P	F	F	F	F	F	F
6		P	P	P	P	F	F	F	F	F	F
7		P	P	P	P	P	F	F	F	F	F
8		P	P	P	P	P	P	F	F	F	F
9		P	P	P	P	P	P	F	F	F	F

1. Before being closed, a Level 5 proposal must:
   1. Run for at least 15 days; AND
   2. Allow at least 7 days after the most recent vote; AND
   3. Have at least 4 participants.
2. For a proposal to be implemented on the Level 5 list:
   1. It must have over 60% support (see table); AND
   2. It must have at least 4 support votes !votes.
3. For proposed additions from August 2024 onwards, the nominator should list (and possibly link to) at least one potential section in the level 5 vital articles list for the article to be added to. Supporters can also help in this regard.

For reference, the following times apply for today:

• 15 days ago is: 00:39, 22 July 2025 (UTC)
• 7 days ago is: 00:39, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

If you're interested in regularly participating as a closer, the following browser tools may also be helpful:

• Streamlined closing with User:DaxServer/DiscussionCloser.js
• One click archiving with User:Elli/OneClickArchiver
  • Consider User:andrybak/Scripts/Archiver if you prefer archiving several discussions in one go

The following link represent all current Level 5 Vital articles that are classified as Arts and everyday life subjects:

Further information: Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/5/Arts/Narrative arts

Further information: Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/5/Arts/Audiovisual arts

Further information: Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/5/Everyday life

Further information: Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/5/Everyday life/Sports, games and recreation

Add Tower  4 topics

The following listings are being relisted here with accrued date priority. They were previously listed at on the STEM page by me. User:Zar2gar1 and User:JpTheNotSoSuperior have both noted that they are more suitable for this page. Where they opposed with conditional support under architecture, their votes have been moved to support-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:02, 13 March 2025 (UTC)

We list Tower  4 and the following are related.

Add Bell tower

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 01:49, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. support under Architecture. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:32, 11 January 2025 (UTC)
3. See the above comment. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:07, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Support  Carlwev  20:41, 22 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Belfry

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 01:49, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. support under Architecture. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:32, 11 January 2025 (UTC)
3. See the above comment. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:07, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 17:17, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Spire

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 01:49, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. support under Architecture. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:32, 11 January 2025 (UTC)
3. See the above comment. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:07, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 10:59, 15 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Steeple

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 01:49, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. support under Architecture. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:32, 11 January 2025 (UTC)
3. See the above comment. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:07, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 21:55, 16 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Watchtower

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:23, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. Weak support, the article isn't very meaty right now, but I guess this makes sense under Fortification  3, which we list here. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 22:19, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
3. See my comments above. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:07, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 17:17, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Guard tower and/or Guardhouse

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:23, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
2. weak support for Guardhouse in Architecture, even if people may not associate architecture with security buildings at first. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 22:19, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Support guardhouse Lazman321 (talk) 05:42, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

1. Maybe the stubby Guard tower should be merged into Watchtower.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:27, 27 December 2024 (UTC)

   I agree completely, even if they typically have slightly different connotations. I'll add it to my big list of VA5 reorg ideas. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 22:19, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

In February, a few months after this thread opened, guard tower article was merged and redirected to watch tower. Just like suggested. Guardhouse is still an article.  Carlwev  16:56, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

All architectural elements are still listed on Technology. Before we can add these candidates anywhere else, we have to finish our vote to move those entries already listed. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 13:32, 29 May 2025 (UTC)

Other arts institutions

If we could get rid of half of the pedestrian colleges and broaden the types of institutions that we list, that would be great.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Add Las Ventas

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Is bullfighting important enough to represent by an arena? If we do list it, it should be on Sports > Stadiums— Preceding unsigned comment added by Lophotrochozoa (talk • contribs) 16:39, 27 May 2025 (UTC)-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 08:56, 18 July 2025 (UTC)

   User:Lophotrochozoa, We list Bullfighting  4 at VA4 you know. So it seems we could and maybe should include a bullfighting arena at Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Everyday_life/Sports,_games_and_recreation#Stadiums, like you suggest.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 09:01, 18 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

Add Teatro Real

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Said to be one of the most prestigious opera houses in Europe. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 16:58, 28 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Seems pretty important. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:19, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add La Scala

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Support. --Moscow Connection (talk) 09:29, 21 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Support. --Thi (talk) 07:54, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
4. I've heard of it. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 14:29, 6 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add La Fenice

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. While I haven't heard of it, it's apparently one of the most famous opera houses. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 21:49, 27 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add The Culinary Institute of America

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Not enough indication of importance. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 18:43, 28 May 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

Add Le Cordon Bleu

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Support GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 02:24, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 18:32, 30 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Bolshoi Ballet

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Iostn (talk) 20:56, 10 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Okay, but the Bolshoi Theatre would be a better addition. (Can be switched later.) --Moscow Connection (talk) 10:07, 21 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add School of American Ballet

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Not enough indication of importance. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 12:46, 31 May 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

Add American Ballet Theatre

Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Weak support. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 15:38, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add Paris Opera Ballet

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Support GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 02:24, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 15:47, 8 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add The Royal Ballet

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Support

1. as nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:53, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Support GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 02:24, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 16:45, 8 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

1. I nominated several colleges/universities to be removed a while back (I think this might still be open for some of them), and definitly support the removal of more. I encourage you to nominate "pedestrian colleges" for removal, I'd likely support that out of hand as I suspect some of these might be included because people associated with the schools pushed a bit. That said, I don't actually know about most of these, which is my ignorance, not to say they AREN'T vital, so would need some brief rational to vote one way or the other. I voted on the ones I've heard of personally. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 02:24, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Remove bowl cut

Looking at Category:Hairstyles and Template:Human hair. There are over 100 article to pick from. I am not sure bowl cut is among the most vital, standing out from the others, I would think it stands out as one of the least vital. Just picking articles at random missing articles concerning hair things are Braid (hairstyle), bob cut, perm (hairstyle), hair gel. And most notably pubic hair. All of which seem more vital than bowl cut. I may suggest pubic hair under biology as well kind of swap for this one.

Support

1. As nom.  Carlwev  08:47, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Judging by the article itself and its low number of interwiki links, seems like a very niche haircut. Lazman321 (talk) 18:00, 27 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Everyday life is below its new quota. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 23:40, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

Add Gwion Gwion rock paintings

These paintings are one of two major regional traditions of rock art found in the north-west Kimberley region of Western Australia. They have been estimated to be approximately 12,000 years old, although there is debate on the date. I think this can round out our art and archeology a bit.

Support

1. As nom. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:34, 24 January 2025 (UTC)
2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 13:37, 28 January 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 17:13, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Swap: Add Tang poetry, remove Complete Tang Poems  5

The former is a broader subject and gets more pageviews, ~50 vs ~15 daily. The latter is just a specific compilation, and a very imperfect one at that according to its article. Rather straightforward swap due to overlap. Can be added to WP:Vital articles/Level/5/Arts#Poetic works of the medieval era I think.

Support

1. As nom.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 11:59, 15 February 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 19:20, 15 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 18:06, 27 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. It's a significant work of poetry, oppose swap with the broader article — Preceding unsigned comment added by Makkool (talk • contribs) 19:24, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

If this fails I'm planning a swap proposal with either Three Hundred Tang Poems or even possibly Quiet Night Thought, both of which have better pageview & interwiki counts and vitality claims.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 16:54, 23 April 2025 (UTC)

Organizational changes to Sports

Remove International cricket  5

I don't know much at all about cricket, but to me this article seems to be about the game of cricket that's codified and governed by International Cricket Council. I think it's enough we list the general listing Cricket  4 and also keep the three forms or formats of international cricket that we have: Test cricket  5, One Day International  5 and Twenty20 International  5. This way we could get away with one level of indented numbering and the last level of indentation wouldn't look so squished on the page.

There's also that we don't list any competing cricket codes to international cricket, like with rugby we have rugby league and rugby union. So that would be another reason I'd rather remove this than keep.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 07:53, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Sensible. J947 ‡ ^edits 21:21, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 22:15, 15 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Remove Gaelic games  5

This article is about games popular in Ireland or originated from there. It's an umbrella term to Gaelic football  5, Hurling  5 and Camogie  5. If we would remove this, we could move gaelic football under football, where it would belong better. Camogie is women's hurling, so it would make more sense to list in under hurling. Gaelic games wouldn't then have anything else under it, so it would be unnecessary to have it anymore. Especially because I don't think we have any other country related team sports articles besides it.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 07:53, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 10:57, 17 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add Futsal  5

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Futsal is indoor association football, or soccer. It's a popular enough sport compared to other team sports that we list as vital. It would be fit well alongside all the other types of football that we list.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 07:53, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Sure. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:03, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
3. 100%. It's arguably the easiest version of soccer to play as well (all you need is a hard surface and goals) which might make it one of the most-played sports in the world especially in the third world. Aurangzebra (talk) 02:10, 16 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 23:53, 17 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Flag football  5

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A safer variant of American football where there is no tackling players to the ground. A reasonably popular sport when comparing to other sports we list. I remember playing both futsal and flag football in PE class at school. Flag football will be a discretionary event for the 2028 Olympics, which will be the first time any gridiron football has been in the Olympics.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 08:19, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
2. On the rise. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 19:03, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Most common form of gridiron football internationally IIRC. The Olympic appearance seals the deal for me. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:31, 2 May 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 12:39, 30 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Still pretty niche. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:21, 9 April 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

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Remove Frisbee sports  5

Remove as an unnecessary umbrella topic. It's enough that we list Disc golf  5 and Ultimate frisbee  5 as individual sports; they're more vital than the category of sports.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:39, 8 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support. --Thi (talk) 07:57, 13 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Don't forget that Frisbee  4 _pbp 03:59, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Remove tea varieties

We used to list much more coffee varieties than we list now, but we cut them down a few years ago. We didn't touch the tea varieties then, so now we list tea disproporionally more compared to coffee. We are over-quota in Everyday life, so I would like to propose some tea varieties to be removed. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Remove Suutei tsai  5

Mongolian tea, not very well known.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support, seems pretty obscure and somewhat redundant to Milk tea  5. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:45, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Remove Thai tea  5

Not very well known globally.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Remove Yellow tea  5

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Not that known tea variety compared to the others.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. "Not that known?" 40 interwikis _pbp 20:53, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

   Compare to white tea with 48, that is less Makkool (talk) 21:35, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

2. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

For transparency, the interwiki amounts are black tea (62), fermented tea (15), green tea (84), oolong (48), white tea (48) and yellow tea (40). For this being in the lower tier, I think it would have justification to be cut. Makkool (talk) 20:44, 10 March 2025 (UTC)

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Remove Chamomile  5

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Somewhat popular herbal infusion, but not that culturally relevant (mostly known for possibly improving sleep quality)

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)
2. The nomination calls it somewhat popular, and the quota for everyday life has been increased so that the page is now under-quota. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 14:36, 14 May 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

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Remove Hibiscus tea  5

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Somewhat popular herbal infusion, but feels less vital than yerba mate or rooibos.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)
2. The nomination calls it somewhat popular, and the quota for everyday life has been increased so that the page is now under-quota. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 22:30, 14 May 2025 (UTC)}}

Neutral

Discuss

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Remove Tea culture  5

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We don't list Coffee culture.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 20:30, 9 March 2025 (UTC)
2. What about beer culture, milk culture...-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 00:03, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Plays a significant role in many cultures and is historic and significant enough to merit a spot. For what it's worth, I would support adding coffee culture, drinking culture, and latte. Aurangzebra (talk) 18:42, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Per other comments. Not seeing this as V5 is just a symptom of Western bias. This is an important aspect of traditional Asian culture. (And even in the West, this used to be a thing in some places, ex. the UK of the Victorian era or so). --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:15, 9 April 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

1. Broadly, I feel like this is a proposal that has a bit of a western bias to it. Tea and Tea culture predate coffee by around 1,000 years. Tea has had a major impact on world events in very extreme ways, such as the events surrounding the Boston Tea Party  5. I would be failing my inner Iroh if I didn't take a stand and say something about this agregious disrespect for tea. If anything, we should be expanding out coverage of the topic. I don't think Coffee has had quite the same tremenodous cultural impact across so many diverse people. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:04, 11 March 2025 (UTC)
   1. Currently we have 4 articles on the varieties of coffee in the Hot drinks section and 13 for tea (18 if you include herbal tea). Even if we consider the historical significance and Western bias I think 1:3 or 1:4,5 ratio is excessive in favor of tea. And I'm not dissing tea, I enjoy having a cuppa every now and then. Would you rather like to see some of the cut coffee articles brought back to the list? I think latte at least should belong as a VA5 article. Makkool (talk) 19:33, 11 March 2025 (UTC)

      Broadly, tea/coffee and other cultural cornerstone food/beverages would not be where I'd start in trying to trim the current list. We have 13 varieties of tea, but how many individual TV shows, movies, musical pieces, or other individual level item. In terms of tea varieties, we are missing most of them. Hōjicha, Matcha, Gunpowder tea, Bancha, Longjing tea, or Kukicha. In terms of coffee, we don't include the Coffee plant, much less varieties like Coffea arabica, Coffea stenophylla and Coffea canephora or specific cultivars like Kona coffee or Bourbon coffee. We're missing terms like Peaberry and Coffee bean. We include Coffee preparation  5, but are missing Coffee roasting, Coffee extraction, as well as common methods of extraction like Coffee percolator and Drip coffee. While I agree latte should be level 5, I don't think that needs to come from our teas when we have 419 specific musical works, and over 15,000 individual people. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 14:06, 12 March 2025 (UTC)

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Add Exercise equipment (set 2 of 2)

Add Elliptical trainer

Not as common equipment as a treadmill or stationary bicycle, but still common enough (especially in fitness centers) that I think most people will recognize.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 02:28, 15 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Health club  5

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One of many things I'm very surprised we don't list already. Also known as a fitness center or weight room, it's where you can do exercises with things like dumbbells and barbells, or you can use a treadmill, stationary bike, or elliptical trainer. Yes, we already list Gym  5, which is similar, but that's more so for sports.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 02:28, 15 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 00:30, 18 May 2025 (UTC)
3. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:35, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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20th century classical music proposals, considered individually

These are ThomEmilAlbe's proposals from last October. I re-opened these proposals individually so that they would get more attention this way. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Remove The Armed Man

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Support

1. Support removal: I like Karl Jenkins, but this doesn't say vital to me. The piece is from 1999, which is quite recent for classical music. We can't say yet how significant this will be considered over the years. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support, Jenkins, who is absent, seems slightly more vital than this work, but I'm not jumping to suggest him  Carlwev  16:44, 10 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Support. --Thi (talk) 08:00, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Worth noting that Karl Jenkins himself is not listed.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 10:02, 20 March 2025 (UTC)

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Remove Csárdás (Monti)

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Support

1. Support removal: Vitality doesn't show from the article. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support  Carlwev  17:51, 9 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Support. --Thi (talk) 08:00, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
4. Not even from a vital composer. Lazman321 (talk) 18:14, 27 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

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Remove Symphony No. 2 (Rachmaninoff)  5 or Piano Concerto No. 3 (Rachmaninoff)  5

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Support

1. Support Piano Concerto No. 3: Rachmaninoff gets four slots when many other composer get less. I trust ThomEmilAlbe's judgement that these are the least vital. Symphony No. 2 is described as very well-known, so I'll support the Piano Concerto. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oh no, the Piano Concerto No. 3 is as good as No. 2. And the Symphony No. 2 is vital as well. I think Rachmaninov gets four slots because he deserves it. (He actually gets more than four slots, but I won't tell you where to look. :-))
   Let them both stay. Especially considering what you are proposing to replace them with below. --Moscow Connection (talk) 10:50, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Oppose. Rachmaninoff's concertos are too important. --Thi (talk) 08:00, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Two oppose votes should be enough to close as failed. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 16:33, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

IMO, not only should all Rachmaninoff's works remain on the list, but his Piano Concerto No. 2 should be elevated to level 4. --Moscow Connection (talk) 11:00, 20 March 2025 (UTC)

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Remove Symphony No. 7 (Sibelius)  5 or Symphony No. 2 (Sibelius)  5

Support

1. Support Symphony No. 7: Sibelius also gets four slots, when many other composers get less. Symphonies 7 and 2 have the least daily pageviews, and of them No. 7 is the stronger case for removal. Wouldn't oppose No. 2 though. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Add Music for 18 Musicians  5

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Support

1. Support add: Minimalism doesn't get enough representation. Music for 18 Musicians really famous and arguably Steve Reich's most known work. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support --Thi (talk) 08:01, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
3. The article for the piece is a bit underwritten in my opinion (no critical reception section at all, currently) but this is definitely a case where the article is inadequate and needs to catch up to the importance of the subject. Keystone minimalist piece, and has a level of popularity that's rare for modern classical. ALittleClass (talk) 08:28, 4 May 2025 (UTC)
4. Important and amazing minimalist work Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

What do you think? Should we add the work (this proposal), or the album? AFAIK, the recording on the album is what made this so famous. Makkool (talk) 20:03, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Worth noting that Symphony No. 3 (Górecki)  5, another minimalist composition, is already listed.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 09:48, 20 March 2025 (UTC)

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Add Violin Concerto (Berg)

Support

1. Support add: Described as composer Alban Berg's most well-known piece. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. --Thi (talk) 11:57, 24 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Wozzeck and Lulu (opera) get more pageviews from his output (and have considerably more interwikis), I'd support adding Lulu instead to represent 12-tone musical works.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 09:42, 20 March 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

Add Le Marteau sans maître

Support

1. Support add: Described as one of composer Pierre Boulez's most well-known pieces. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Add Einstein on the Beach  5

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Support

1. Support add: Another work to represent minimalism, and I also think Philip Glass should get at least one work. Makkool (talk) 18:56, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Philip Glass  4 should be big enough to have representation of individual works.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 10:00, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Support --Thi (talk) 08:03, 13 April 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

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Coffee additions

My proposals for tea removals didn't get unanimous support, and people seemed to be open for coffee to be represented more. I dug the page history and these articles used to be listed back in 2023. They were subsequently removed, when the tea articles remained untouched. I propose that we return at least some of them.

Add Latte  5

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Support

1. World-famous Italian milk coffee drink. Very culturally relevant in the western world. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Very common. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:34, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:15, 1 May 2025 (UTC)
4. ALittleClass (talk) 08:31, 4 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

I won't vote against this one (I've voted against "Caffè americano" and "Caffè mocha"), but I think "Milk coffee  5" would be a better addition. Cause there are many drinks that are essentially the same old milk and coffee, and the article "Milk coffee" talks about the concept.
Also, please note that "Latte" doesn't even have a Spanish interwiki, the Spanish article "es:Café con leche" links to our "Milk coffee". (Not to our "Café con leche", by the way.) --Moscow Connection (talk) 09:42, 21 March 2025 (UTC)

Good point! We already have Milk tea  5, so Milk coffee should be added as well, when it exists as a separate article. I made a new proposal for it, if you would like to support it instead. Makkool (talk) 11:44, 21 March 2025 (UTC)

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Add Caffè americano

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Support

1. Another very popular coffee drink. You can order one in most cafés today. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Seems common enough. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:34, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Per above. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 20:36, 19 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Sorry, but I don't see the need to add essentially the same thing three times. --Moscow Connection (talk) 09:31, 21 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Oppose Quite trivial. --Thi (talk) 08:07, 13 April 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

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Add Caffè mocha

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Support

1. A traditional and well-known coffee drink with added chocolate. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Very common. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:34, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 17:25, 12 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Sorry, but I don't see the need to add essentially the same thing three times. --Moscow Connection (talk) 09:32, 21 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Oppose Quite trivial. --Thi (talk) 08:07, 13 April 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

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Add Coffee culture (new article)

Support

1. We haven't had this article before, but there was support to add this along Tea culture. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 00:22, 21 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 17:36, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Add Turkish coffee (new article)

Support

1. Quite famous regional coffee preparation method. We should add some other coffee type from elsewhere than Italy. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support - more vital than half the cocktails we list. Over 60 interwiki languages. Seems more vital than the listed Rum and Coke or Applejack (drink) [1]  Carlwev  08:01, 1 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 11:35, 12 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Add Drip coffee (new article)

Support

1. Very common coffee preparation method. We should add at least some other coffee type than espresso-based. Makkool (talk) 19:37, 19 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 02:17, 18 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Add Milk coffee  5 (new article)

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Support

1. To be paired with Milk tea. Makkool (talk) 11:44, 21 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support. See my comment at #Add Latte. --Moscow Connection (talk) 12:11, 21 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Definitely. QuicoleJR (talk) 15:25, 27 March 2025 (UTC)
4. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 17:05, 18 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

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Add Xbox and PlayStation

We list the consoles themselves, but not the companies behind them.

Support

1. Interstellarity (talk) 13:15, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Support listing these brands. Kevinishere15 (talk) 07:55, 22 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 21:41, 29 May 2025 (UTC)
4. While yes, the consoles and companies have already been listed, I do feel the brands are iconic as well. Lazman321 (talk) 17:40, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. I don't see a point to listing the brands. We already list Microsoft  4 and Sony  5, the actual companies behind the consoles. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:06, 20 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Per Quciole. ALittleClass (talk) 06:07, 6 June 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Add Exercise ball

Another common piece of exercise equipment that's not listed yet. Yoga balls are listed under this page as well.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:04, 22 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 21:17, 19 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Gold medal, Silver medal, and Bronze medal

Well known prize medals awarded in several fields, most notably athletics.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 04:28, 24 March 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. I don't see the reason to take up three spaces of these when they're all covering roughly the same topic. EchoVanguardZ (talk) 19:15, 24 March 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Add Olympic medal

Speaking of prize medals, this is THE most iconic prize medal of them all.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 04:31, 24 March 2025 (UTC)
2. Relatively important. EchoVanguardZ (talk) 19:16, 24 March 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 17:49, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Our Gang

Also known as The Little Rascals. Only 12 interwikis but the franchise consists of a two-decade run of 220 theatrical short films and many spinoffs. The series "broke new ground by portraying white and black children interacting as equals during the Jim Crow era" and the "characters in this series are well-known cultural icons", including Carl "Alfalfa" Switzer. CopiousAmountofCannons (talk) 00:53, 11 April 2025 (UTC).

Support

1. Per nom. CopiousAmountofCannons (talk) 00:53, 11 April 2025 (UTC).
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 18:41, 21 May 2025 (UTC)
3. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:39, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Gyeongbokgung

The main royal palace of Korea for centuries and I think the most visited and prominent tourist attraction of South Korea. Seen as a symbol of Korea as a whole. I wrote current article, still working on it. Before my edits. Maybe will take to GA.

Should go under Arts/Specific structures. Think it's at least as prominent as many other things on the list.

Support

1. As nominator. seefooddiet (talk) 23:18, 11 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 21:33, 12 June 2025 (UTC)
3. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. Unlike the other propsed item, this is not UNESCO level. 40 interwikis is ok, but the article (lead and tourist) does not make much of a case currently it is particularly influential. One survey in which 30% of locals called it the most scenic place. Sorry, not seeing how this is vital - at least, not from the current article, which makes next to no case that this is particulrly iconic, even in Korea, not to mention worldwide. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:02, 15 April 2025 (UTC)

   Argh. Tourism information and cultural significance is on my to-do list on expanding the article. I may renominate again later. I know you're just following the letter of the law and know this is the most important palace otherwise. seefooddiet (talk) 03:09, 15 April 2025 (UTC)

   @Piotrus: I just updated the article with more info. Gyeongbokgung#Tourism is this enough for now? I can add more if not. seefooddiet (talk) 02:36, 16 April 2025 (UTC)

   Thank you. That's good, for now I'll move my vote from oppose to neutral/discuss. Ping me when you are done improving the article, with th efocus on showing how this site is important for Korea/the world (i.e. why it is vital). Right now I am a bit on the fence - yes, it is important (in fact, I've seen it, I live in Korea...) but it would be good to argue how it is similar (in terms of page views, interlanguage links and arguments) to comparable stuff we list in V5. That would make your proposal stronger. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:55, 16 April 2025 (UTC)

   For pageviews, Gyeongbokgung pretty consistently beats out these other entries: Pageviews 1 Pageviews 2 Pageviews 3

   I think Gyeongbokgung's cultural significance and age beats out the following entries:

   • Tahrir Square
     • A modern structure, and there's nothing in particular here other than the square itself (I've been). I'd argue Gyeongbokgung is much more significant in Korean history. Besides being the seat of the monarchy, especially of Korea's Sejong the Great and the location of the invention of Hangul, Gyeongbokgung was the site of the first electric light in Korea, the Assassination of Empress Myeongseong (keystone moment in Korean history), the seat of the Japanese colonial government (Government-General of Chōsen Building), and the seat of the American occupational government. Its front square (Gwanghwamun Square, named for Gyeongbokgung's front gate) is the site of regular major political protests.
   • Jatiya Sangsad Bhaban
     • A modern government complex, currently article only describes it as large, used by govt, and beautifully designed; doesn't seem to outweigh the history and cultural significance of Gyeongbokgung
   • Saint Alexander Nevsky Cathedral, Sofia
     • Largest cathedral in the Balkans, but a modern structure. Article is currently poorly developed and doesn't explain significance of it beyond that.
   • Neuschwanstein Castle
     • Visitor statistics here; 1.3 million annual visitors is lower than Gyeongbokgung, which has received around 2.5-3 million annually since 2002. (see Gyeongbokgung#Tourism). It mentions the castle being a symbol of Romanticism, but unsourced.
   • Ostankino Tower
     • A modern structure, and no real discussion of cultural significance besides being the tallest free-standing structure in Europe and used for broadcasting.

   In terms of visitor numbers, Gyeongbokgung likely beats out a reasonable number of the sites. seefooddiet (talk) 05:13, 16 April 2025 (UTC)

Swap Cuban rumba for Merengue music

The Dominican Republic has a slightly larger population than Cuba which is represented by Music of Cuba  5 and Bolero  4. Notable merengue artists include Juan Luis Guerra  5, Johnny Ventura, Sergio Vargas and Rubby Pérez (died in the recent nightclub roof collapse). Cuban rumba is not to be confused with Rhumba  5 or Congolese rumba  5.

Support

1. As nom. Sahaib (talk) 22:22, 15 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Mixed

1. Add merengue, don't remove Cuban rumba. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 11:16, 19 June 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

Add Torte and/or Layer cake

For Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Everyday_life#Food_types. Above we are likely to add cupcake and muffin. Donut is V5 already. So is sponge cake. And I like my sweets (they'll like be the death of me...). Anyway, when I think cakes, in Polish, the word "tort" is very common. I have to admit I have not heard "torte" used in English, but well, we have an article on that. I also note that we have an article on a very similar concept, that of a Sandwich cake (sandwich cake redirects there). Torte has 37 interwikis; layer cake just 14 (and no pl wiki version). The current articles don't seem to make a good case that they are not synonyms, so I'll suggest a merge. For now, we should add at least one of these, or maybe both (and see what merge discussion will end up with). I have a feeling that this is the same concept, but better known in English as a layer cake, and in many other countries, as a tort. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:20, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nominator. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:20, 17 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Support layer cake. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:56, 19 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Support layer cake. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 23:05, 27 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

"Torte" is an important topic. At first, I was happy to see something that actually translates to many other European languages. But what bothers me is that the French Wikipedia simply links this concept to Pastry  4, which i already level 4. And there's neither a Spanish article. --Moscow Connection (talk) 17:26, 17 April 2025 (UTC)

Remove Coin magic

Niche topic at ~15-20 daily pageviews and 1 interwiki. Other stage magic articles such as Sleight of hand  5 should be sufficient.

Support

1. As nom.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 09:00, 19 April 2025 (UTC)
2. _pbp 11:30, 19 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Given the everyday life section is underquota, I think this is sufficiently vital. We are not pressed for space at VA5 yet. ALittleClass (talk) 02:12, 23 May 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

1. I guess. That said, it is something that is seen here and there. Magic (illusion)  4 is V4. Similar. Card manipulation  5 is V5, as is Sleight of hand  5 and Escapology  5. And few others: Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Arts#Magic. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:32, 19 April 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

To consuder to add: as intermediaries or additions, there's Close-up magic and Platform magic to consider as general catch-them-all terms. Talking about individual tricks that are pretty famous, I'd consider Hat-trick (magic trick), Sawing a woman in half and Predicament escape, although the latter may be a mergeable fork to escapology. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:32, 19 April 2025 (UTC)

Add Hat-trick (magic trick)

Seems pretty iconic, at least as much as other stuff listed at Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Arts#Magic. Just 3 interwikis, but still... --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:40, 19 April 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nom. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:40, 19 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Sure. A lot of people know what this is. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 02:20, 23 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Primeira Liga

We currently list (arguably) the top 6 biggest domestic soccer leagues in Europe, alongside Russia's league, which would probably be in the top 7 if it wasn't for a suspension in international competition. However, there's one more big European league that I feel should be listed: Portugal's. Portugal's league is arguably historically better than both the Netherlands and Russia (Portugal's league was listed ahead of the Netherlands league in UEFA rankings until a few years ago). We also list a team from Portugal (FC Porto  5).

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:49, 29 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Idiosincrático (talk) 15:58, 5 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Feminist art removed without discussion

JpTheNotSoSuperior has removed Feminist art and I can't find any discussion approving this removal.

Remove

Restore

Neutral

1. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 12:15, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

@JpTheNotSoSuperior and JpTheNotSoSuperior:: Explain? Why didn't you discuss first? Why did you think it uncontroversial? _pbp 12:32, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

Perhaps a misunderstanding about what has been said about boldly handling redirected/merged items? Feminist art currently redirects to Feminist art movement. I say a redirect can be boldly removed if it leads to an already included article (since Cewbot eventually bypasses redirects so there would be a duplicate anyway), which is not the case here since Feminist art movement  5 is not listed. The proper thing to do, as far as I can tell, would be to replace Feminist art with Feminist art movement or just let Cewbot do it.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 12:55, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

Per User:LaukkuTheGreit-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 11:12, 7 May 2025 (UTC)

Apologies for my late response. I re-added feminist art movement. I removed it initially because it seemed like it was too different of a topic compared to feminist art itself (and the low interwikis don't help). Of note, Feminist movement itself isn't listed, so that should probably be added too. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 22:39, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

Add important subgenres

I have noticed some gaps in our coverage of important subgenres of Level 4 genres. The below proposals are intended to help rectify that issue.

Add Psychological horror  5

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A major subgenre of Horror fiction  4, which currently only has Gothic fiction  5 as a subgenre. It deserves to be listed. 25 interwikis, rated High-Importance by WikiProject Horror and WikiProject Psychology,

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:04, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
2. We already list examples like Silent Hill  5 and The Silence of the Lambs (film)  5. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:18, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Yes. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:18, 2 May 2025 (UTC)
4. Definitely. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 23:35, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Lovecraftian horror  5

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Also known as cosmic horror or eldritch horror, this is another very important subgenre of Horror fiction  4. This is the reason we list H. P. Lovecraft  4 at Level 4. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Culture, WikiProject Horror, and WikiProject United States.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:04, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:25, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Yes. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:18, 2 May 2025 (UTC)
4. Common enough. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 23:35, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Historical romance

A very popular and important subgenre of Romance novel  4, which is underrepresented at this level compared to other genres. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Novels and Top-Importance by WikiProject Romance.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:04, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:21, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
3. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 23:30, 21 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Contemporary romance

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A very popular and important subgenre of Romance novel  4, which is underrepresented at this level compared to other genres. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Literature and Top-Importance by WikiProject Romance.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:04, 30 April 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Military science fiction  5

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A major subgenre of Science fiction  4, similar in importance to Space opera  5. It has also had an impact on real life militaries. 30 interwikis, rated High-Importance by WikiProject Science fiction.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:04, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
2. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:22, 30 April 2025 (UTC)
3. aye. Wasn't going to add this myself as I'm a bit bias towards the genre but I'll support. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 04:17, 2 May 2025 (UTC)
4. I am pretty sure I suggested it a while back, and it did not fly back then. Too lazy to check the archive. Support, of course. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 11:18, 2 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Debut novel

A very important literary topic. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Literature and Top-Importance by WikiProject Novels.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 22:12, 2 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Lazman321 (talk) 17:15, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Mas que nada

Non western music is underrepresented in the "modern music" section, the only other song from South America I could find in the category is The Girl from Ipanema. This is an anthem of Brazil, is known internationally, and has multiple famous recordings. If a swap was necessary I would suggest Waterloo (ABBA already has Dancing Queen which is definitely their more iconic song) or Stand by Your Man.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 01:32, 3 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Support. --Moscow Connection (talk) 09:48, 5 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Sure, we need more Latin music representation. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:27, 11 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Swap: Remove FIG World Cup  5, add Artistic Gymnastics World Cup

FIG has 2 interwikis and Artistic Gym World Cup has 9. The FIG article is more or less a container article for the Artistic Gym World Cup and the Rhythmic Gym world cup _pbp 01:28, 10 May 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. _pbp 01:28, 10 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Support removal only. Convincing case was made that FIG is not vital, but I am not convinced AGWP is, hence, I see no need for the addition. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:17, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Support removal, oppose addition per Piotrus. Lophotrochozoa (talk) 16:45, 23 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Ping User:Purplebackpack89 - did you mean to oppose your own proposal...? --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:17, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

Remove Spork and Splayd

I don't think either of these are actually vital, but splayd is less important.

Support

1. As nominator. EchoVanguardZ (talk) 02:35, 13 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Support  Carlwev  03:07, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose spork; I feel they are common enough to stay. No opinion on splayd, as I am unfamiliar with those (side note: I'd support all of the articles listed below). JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 23:50, 20 May 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

Most hybrid utensils or weapons don't sound vital, dagger-axe may be removed soon. There are several Combination eating utensils that are included in that article like knork, spife, that do not even have there own article, let alone a vital one. Looking at Category:Food_preparation_utensils or perhaps Category:Spoons there are many traditional utensils that appear in more languages that my instincts say would be better. Articles like whisk, cookie cutter, cutting board, spatula, corkscrew sound more vital.  Carlwev  03:07, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

User:Carlwev, please nominate these.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:36, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

Add Cinema of Thailand

Thailand is a large country with an extensive history of filmmaking and some international success. If we have room for the cinema of 25 other countries, such as Germany and Australia, I think we can make room for Thailand.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:14, 13 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Highlife

A music genre that is very popular in several African countries, especially Ghana and Nigeria. We underrepresent African culture, and this is an example of that. I don't see any reason not to list it.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:55, 13 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Iostn (talk) 14:14, 14 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Bluevestman (talk) 20:12, 20 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add International Chopin Piano Competition

It's one of the most important piano competitions and classical music awards. It is devoted entirely to Frédéric Chopin  4's pieces. Many past winners are level 5 vital, including Martha Argerich  5, Krystian Zimerman  5 and Yundi  5. It can be added to Music awards under Music section of Arts.

Support

1. As nom -EleniXDD※Talk 03:59, 17 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Seems very important. QuicoleJR (talk) 10:55, 17 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Well known in Poland, at least. And to some degree worldwide, I think. Fair at V5. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:27, 14 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add The Imitation of Christ

The second most read devotional book in Christianity, popularized the idea of living like Christ would have and the "What would Jesus do?" lines of thinking. The author, Thomas à Kempis, is already Level-5 vital, and this book is essentially the sole source of his legacy.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 03:18, 21 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Seems pretty important. QuicoleJR (talk) 11:29, 22 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom., we have space for important non-fiction books Makkool (talk) 18:25, 19 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Not just the second-most read Christian devotional today, but has been for centuries. Johnnie Runner (talk) 01:53, 02 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Phineas and Ferb

Hugely popular TV show and one of Disney Channel's most successful shows.

Support

1. Interstellarity (talk) 21:25, 22 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Weak support upon further consideration. The long term cultural impact of this show is probably more than any other Disney Channel show. Again, as I mentioned in a below comment, it's had two decades of staying power. Four base seasons + two more from popular demand (and creator passion too), two films, and the characters becoming icons held at a similar regard as tons of other Disney characters. P&F proved to have staying power on a global scale beyond just being a cultural fad. You can't say the same about Hannah Montana. λ NegativeMP1 17:11, 24 May 2025 (UTC)
3. As far as I'm aware, Disney Channel has no representation among the vital articles right now. (Ducktales doesn't count because it was syndicated.) If not Gravity Falls, then this one at least. Lazman321 (talk) 19:34, 16 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Definitely popular, but I wouldn't say it is one of the most important shows of the 21st century. Gravity Falls would probably be a better Disney Channel show to list. SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 21:58, 22 May 2025 (UTC)
   1. Gravity Falls was previously on the list but removed in the past for not being influential enough long term. λ NegativeMP1 22:08, 22 May 2025 (UTC)
      1. I had a feeling I saw it on the list before. I would support it to be re-added if somebody ever proposes it, I think Gravity Falls has had a similar impact relative to other cartoons we list like Steven Universe  5 and Adventure Time  5. SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 16:43, 24 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Too many American television shows as is _pbp 17:43, 24 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Idiosincrático (talk) 15:47, 5 June 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

1. I would rather list this over Hannah Montana but I don't know if either should be here anyways. At least Phineas and Ferb lasted for a long time, is about to return, and was a decently influential animated TV show. And that return was due to popular demand + creator passion. It's had almost two decades of staying power. Hannah Montana was just a fad that nowadays is only looked back on because of nostalgia. Either that or being used for comparisons of different points in Miley Cyrus  5's career (whom I also don't think should be vital). It isn't even the most popular or important Disney Channel series of all time (unless I'm misremembering, I'm pretty sure that was Jessie). Maybe with a swap I'll weakly support P&F. λ NegativeMP1 22:08, 22 May 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

Add Cowbell (instrument)

Common musical instrument that's not listed yet.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 02:35, 27 May 2025 (UTC)
2. And culturally significant. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 23:02, 31 May 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Kazoo

Another common musical instrument that's not listed yet (although I feel it's not really used for music).

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 02:37, 27 May 2025 (UTC)
2. Per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:04, 27 May 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. not feeling it.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 11:47, 5 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Add a few major zoos

Zoo  4 is currently a V4 topic, yet it has no subtopics to list. Zoos are obviously an important part of everyday life and society, and the "sports, games, and recreation" sublist is under quota, so I figured I should propose a few important zoos to help represent the topic more.

Add London Zoo

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Has been open since 1828 and continues to bring in over a million guests annually. It's also notable for being the first scientific zoo; as well as having the first reptile house, public aquarium, insect house, and children's zoo.

Support

1. As nom. User:SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 03:29, 3 June 2025 (UTC)
2. ALittleClass (talk) 06:33, 3 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Famous. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:46, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
4. Bluevestman (talk) 22:29, 20 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Bronx Zoo

Has been open since 1899 and is an iconic landmark in New York City. It's credited with having reintroduced endangered species such as the American bison and Chinese alligator into the wild.

Support

1. As nom. User:SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 03:29, 3 June 2025 (UTC)
2. ALittleClass (talk) 06:33, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add San Diego Zoo

Has been open since 1916 and is the most visited zoo in the US. It's also cited as "one of the best zoos in the world." It has won a slew of awards since at least 1958.

Support

1. As nom. User:SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 03:29, 3 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Sure. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 18:22, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
3. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 01:20, 9 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Very iconic location. QuicoleJR (talk) 01:37, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

1. This was also where the very first YouTube  4 video was filmed. Kevinishere15 (talk) 09:35, 4 June 2025 (UTC)

Add Schönbrunn Zoo

Has been open since 1752 and, brings in about 2 million visitors annually, and contains over 700 species. It's well known for its many successful conservation and breeding projects.

Support

1. As nom. User:SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 03:29, 3 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Specific film proposals

The Specific films section has some missed opportunities I would like to address:

Add The Birds (film)

A classic Alfred Hitchcock thriller and one of his most well known works. There are 54 interwikis.

Support

1. Support automatically as nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 14:25, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. --Thi (talk) 12:01, 24 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Seems pretty important, although Narrative Arts might need another quota boost soon at this rate. QuicoleJR (talk) 11:59, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Swap Full Metal Jacket  5 with Paths of Glory  5

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Paths of Glory  5 is widely considered Stanley Kubrick's first masterpiece, and is also far more influential than a very similar film released three decades later to significantly less acclaim. Being on the National Film Registry certainly helps.

Support

1. Support automatically as nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 14:25, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Add but don't swap. Both are influential, but Full Metal Jacket is more iconic in pop culture. SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) — Preceding undated comment added 18:19, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Support add with no swap. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:15, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
4. Support add with no swap. ALittleClass (talk) 21:33, 4 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add The Great Escape (film)  5

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A major and influential classic, not to mention Steve McQueen's breakout role as an actor. There are 43 interwikis.

Support

1. Support automatically as nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 14:25, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Surprised this wasn't already listed. SameOldSameOldSameOld (talk) 18:29, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
3. --Thi (talk) 12:01, 24 June 2025 (UTC)¨
4. Iostn (talk) 16:20, 6 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

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Add Bullitt

Another famous Steve McQueen film, that just so happens to be the progenitor of the car chase scene. There are 35 interwikis.

Support

1. Support automatically as nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 14:25, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Article demonstrates enough cultural impact and industry influence to warrant listing. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:03, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add The Story of the Kelly Gang

Now ask yourself: Why else would the very first feature film not be listed? Only 13 interwikis, but that is to be expected, being a film from 1906.

Support

Oppose

1. Was removed earlier for being mostly lost and the length threshold for a feature film, as noted on that article, being subjective. It also states There was no sudden increase in the running times of films to the present-day definitions of feature-length; the "featured" film on a film program in the early 1910s gradually expanded from two to three to four reels, implying the Kelly Gang film wasn't that particular of a breakthrough.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 06:06, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Per LaukkuTheGreit. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:00, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

Chinese Pop Proposals

Add C-pop

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The general term for Chinese pop music, covering genres such as Cantopop  5, Mandopop, and Hokkien pop. Perhaps not quite as internationally widespread as K-pop  4 or J-pop  4, but still very important just because of the scale of the audience within chinese-speaking regions.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 22:56, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. China is big. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 03:35, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Seems important enough to list. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:00, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
4. --Thi (talk) 15:02, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

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Add Mandopop

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Pop music sung in mandarin. It has most likely surpassed Cantopop  5 in global popularity due to the amount of people that speak Mandarin compared to Cantonese, so I think we should list both.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 22:56, 4 June 2025 (UTC)
2. More well-established as a term thn C-Pop Iostn (talk) 19:16, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Seems important enough to list. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:00, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
4. --Thi (talk) 15:02, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

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Add Statue of Unity

World's tallest statue.

Support

1. Interstellarity (talk) 00:31, 6 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Add One World Trade Center

The lead building of the World Trade Center complex.

Support

1. Interstellarity (talk) 00:39, 6 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Add The Clock Towers

Tallest clock tower in the world.

Support

1. Interstellarity (talk) 00:43, 6 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Euthyphro

One of the most important of Plato's dialogues, famous for the Euthyphro dilemma, simply stated as "Is something pious because the gods approve of it, or do the gods approve of it because is it pious?"

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 20:01, 9 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Seems very impactful, and Plato  3 is Level 3. QuicoleJR (talk) 23:52, 21 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add some more super hero villains discussion and a few proposals.

Looking at Superhero media we include two villains, Joker (character)  5 and Catwoman  5. While These are fine characters, they are both not only DC Comics  5, but both are Batman  4 villains. We include 12 heros, I think we likely need an equal number of villains.

Add Thanos

The big bad for Avengers: Endgame and several of the others, for those who care 48 language links and 1,475 average daily pageviews. He is a Marvel villain, so balance a bit.

Support

1. As nom. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 03:45, 10 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Weak-ish support within the context of the current proposal. I wanted to add him when the removal of Doctor Doom was proposed. I still somewhat stand by that. Yes, his popularity is a lot more recent than other fictional characters. Yes, characters like Wolverine (character)  5 could easily come before him (and I'd support his addition too). But remember that his recent popularity was for being part of the biggest cinematic event of the 2000s-2010s. Over a decade worth of film releases built up to Endgame and it became the highest grossing film of all time until Avatar (2009 film)  5 got re-released in China a couple years later. Even now, both it and Infinity War remain in the top 10. Thanos is easily within the top 150-ish most popular fictional characters as it stands right now. Now, again, are there characters that could be added before him? Yes. As already said, I would add Wolverine. There's probably several fictional characters who could be added from all fields before him. But I feel like he would show up on the pending list sooner rather than later. λ NegativeMP1 00:31, 11 June 2025 (UTC)
3. After thinking about it, support per MP1. Kevinishere15 (talk) 05:20, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
4. Bluevestman (talk) 21:46, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
5. Lazman321 (talk) 04:56, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Recentism, as the movie(s) he was the villain in age, he will be forgotten again. He is not recurring enough to be vital or to have a lasting impression on popculture, IMHo. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 04:23, 14 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Per above Iostn (talk) 19:16, 15 June 2025 (UTC)
3. --LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 11:18, 18 June 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

1. Thanos only became popular outside of hardcore comic fans very recently, with Infinity War/Endgame, all the other villains here have much more legacy Kevinishere15 (talk) 20:49, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

• That's fair. The reason I listed him first is because from a quantitative perspective the two variables people use the most are views and language links. People like to emphasize the language links which we still haven't formalized. Of these, Thanos had the highest metrics. This is likely a good example of why those two variables are not the best to lean on. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 20:55, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

1. Would probably prefer to list a specific MCU movie before this. ALittleClass (talk) 02:43, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Add Lex Luthor  5

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A big bad for Superman  4, for those who care 38 language links and 1,108 daily pageviews.

Support

1. As nom. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 03:45, 10 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Superman is V4 so a subtopic makes sense, I proposed adding the 1978 movie but it was rejected. Kevinishere15 (talk) 05:51, 10 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Easily. Character has existed for over 80 years, is one of the first fictional supervillains of his kind, and the predominant villain for probably the historically most important superhero. And again, Superman could easily get a sub-topic. λ NegativeMP1 00:33, 11 June 2025 (UTC)
4. Bluevestman (talk) 21:45, 17 June 2025 (UTC)
5. He was removed in March 2024, but I don't agree with the reasoning for that removal. I think he makes the character list. QuicoleJR (talk) 23:42, 21 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

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Add Magneto (Marvel Comics)

The big bad for X-Men  5, for those who care 35 language links and 1,146 aveage daily pageviews. He is a Marvel villain, so balance a bit.

Support

1. As nom. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 03:45, 10 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Weakly. Enduring presence in popculture, I think. More than Doctor Doom, IMHO, but that may be subjective. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:17, 18 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:27, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

Add Green Goblin

A big bad for Spiderman, for those who care 35 language links and 526 daily pageviews. He is a Marvel villain, so balance a bit.

Support

1. As nom. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 03:45, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. I just can't help but see his entire concept as a joke. I don't know if any Spiderman villains entered popculture much. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:18, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
2. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:28, 9 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

1. I feel that Venom (character) is the more iconic Spider-Man villain. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 18:52, 19 June 2025 (UTC)

   Seconded. λ NegativeMP1 05:39, 21 June 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 03:45, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

1. @GeogSage: You posted Luthor twice. Kevinishere15 (talk) 06:08, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

   Thanks for catching that. I formatted it once and copy pasted it several times. Luthor was the first that came to mind before some lite Googling, so they were all Luthor before I swapped the relevant names/data. GeogSage ^{(⚔Chat?⚔)} 06:38, 10 June 2025 (UTC)

Add Walk This Way

Admittedly we got a lot of rock songs/albums on here, but I'm not advocating for the original Aerosmith  5's version. Rather it's the Run-DMC  4's cover that I think is vital. While Run-DMC have incorporated rock into their work before, their collaboration with Aerosmith is by far the first thing people think of as the first rap rock song. It also helped revived Aerosmith's career.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 22:27, 17 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. If Rap rock were a vital genre. λ NegativeMP1 05:39, 21 June 2025 (UTC)

Add Supergirl

Likely the second most famous female superhero. Wonder Woman is V4, we can have one more at V5. 30+ interwikis. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:20, 18 June 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nom. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:20, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
2. At V5, sure. λ NegativeMP1 05:36, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Bluevestman (talk) 16:24, 14 July 2025 (UTC)
4. --Thi (talk) 15:07, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Enka

A major Japanese music genre, enka has been popular in the country for decades. It has also had a lot of influence on Taiwanese music. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Japan, it has 28 interwikis and gets good pageviews.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:59, 18 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Reasonable at V5. 28 iwikis. --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 06:45, 21 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Iostn (talk) 16:20, 6 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Bluevestman (talk) 20:09, 2 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Glockenspiel

Speaking of spiels, THIS!

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 20:35, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Bluevestman (talk) 21:52, 19 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Belém Tower

Major Lisbon landmark. World Heritage Site. Has 55 interwikis.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 19:24, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Hassan II Mosque

Not only a major landmark in Casablanca, it's also one of the largest mosques in the world. Has 51 interwikis.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 20:10, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Highland games

The sporting event in the Scottish community. Might be too niche, but I think it's worth discussing.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 23:32, 20 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Iostn (talk) 16:20, 6 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Kiss Me Deadly

Very, very influential film noir. It's in the National Film Registry, it's on WikiProject Film's core list, and it has 23 interwikis. Shocked to see this one not listed as vital.

Support

1. Major influence on a bunch of V4 directors, Quentin Tarantino  4, Jean-Luc Godard  4, François Truffaut  4. (I'm not the nom BTW) Kevinishere15 (talk) 07:57, 23 June 2025 (UTC)
2. As nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 06:18, 24 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Per nom and Kevin. QuicoleJR (talk) 01:54, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Schönbrunn Palace

Main summer residence for the House of Habsburg  4.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 19:14, 23 June 2025 (UTC)
2. We could list more buildings Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Fantastic Four

Admittedly, their success on the big screen has been… mixed, but they are still the foundation for Marvel Comics  5.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 19:26, 23 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Important superheroes Makkool (talk) 18:31, 19 July 2025 (UTC)
3. --Thi (talk) 15:07, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. FYI, this failed to be added March last year. Makkool (talk) 18:31, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Freddy Krueger and Jason Voorhees

Huge iconic slasher villains. We don't have their film series, but this is a case where the characters (particularly Jason) are more vital than the works they originated from.

Support

1. Bluevestman (talk) 20:12, 23 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Add Slasher film  5 first.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 20:23, 23 June 2025 (UTC)

Slasher film  5 seems to be easily passing, revoking oppose vote now.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 21:09, 24 June 2025 (UTC)

1. I'd rather add Michael Myers (earlier than Krueger or Voorhees) or Norman Bates (even earlier iconic killer character) Makkool (talk) 17:41, 19 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Weak oppose, and I agree with Makkool that Michael Myers would be the first one to add. These two are iconic, yes, but I'm not sure that they reach the level of importance or fame that would warrant listing. We don't list Master Chief (Halo) or Goofy, and they are at a similar level of fame to these two. As a side note, we really should list Halloween (franchise), the franchise where Myers is from, due to its popularity and impact on the slasher film genre. QuicoleJR (talk) 01:50, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

   I just nominated Halloween (1978 film) for inclusion on the list. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:40, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Discuss

Add Ender's Game

?????

(also, spawned a $110 million dollar budget motion picture)

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 08:37, 25 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add A Hard Day's Night (film), possibly remove Saturday Night Fever  5

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

The former is an immensely iconic and influential Musical film  5 that influenced a number of other musicals, and has a bigger legacy than the latter.

On top of us listing only seven musical films, the Cinema of the United Kingdom  5 is somewhat underrepresented here, especially compared to the number of American films (Cinema of the United States  4) listed.

The Beatles  3 themselves are already VA3 (unsurprisingly), so their most famous film production also deserves to be listed. Saturday Night Fever  5 while probably the weakest musical currently listed is also quite influential however, so I'm split on whether to remove it or not. Opinions are welcome.

Support

1. As nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 15:25, 27 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. I understand the Beatles are rightfully V3 as an obviously very important influential band, but when the band is already very well represented across the entire vital articles project, I don't feel compelled to support the addition of an article with the only claim to fame being that it featured the Beatles. And it definitely should not replace SNF. λ NegativeMP1 21:28, 27 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Per above. Kevinishere15 (talk) 21:43, 28 June 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discuss

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Add Forbidden Planet

A very famous and culturally important Science fiction film  5. It was the first film to have an entirely electronic music score; the first to be set on an exoplanet; the first to depict faster-than-light travel; is included in the National Film Registry; is frequently referenced in popular culture, and the Robby the Robot character is also a cultural icon. It's definitely no 2001, but since we list a surprisingly low number of true blockbusters like this, we could probably squeeze this one in.

Support

1. As nominator. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 02:04, 29 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Lazman321 (talk) 05:20, 13 July 2025 (UTC)
3. It has enough of an impact on Science fiction  4 to warrant a Level 5 slot. QuicoleJR (talk) 12:07, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Antique

Should explain itself, but they are items of significant value which people will often seek to acquire and/or sell at high prices.

Support

1. As nom. PrimalMustelid (talk) 02:41, 29 June 2025 (UTC)
2. Yeah. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:32, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add The Outsiders (novel)

The debut novel of vital article writer S. E. Hinton  5, commercially successful at 15 million copies sold, often taught in middle and high schools, and very influential in YA literature, being one of the first realistic novels specifically targeted to teenagers. [2][3]

Support

1. As nom Lazman321 (talk) 17:21, 30 June 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discussion

Would put it under Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Arts#Children's_and_young_adult_books. Worth noting that the few contemporary YA novels in that section are all fantasy novels, meaning this novel would be representing realistic YA novels. Lazman321 (talk) 05:27, 13 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Bedroom in Arles

For Vincent van Gogh  3 we have one work (The Potato Eaters  5) and 2 series (Wheat Fields  5 and Sunflowers (Van Gogh series)  5). With additional spaces in the arts, I think we should give this consideration.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:31, 3 July 2025 (UTC)

We also have The Starry Night  4, Portrait of Dr. Gachet  5 and Café Terrace at Night  5-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:22, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nom. Although we have a soft limit of 3 works per artist, there are exceptions for VA3 subjects that sometimes have up to 6 works (see Michelangelo and Leonardo da Vinci). All three versions of this work are on display in VA5 art museums (Van Gogh Museum  5, Art Institute of Chicago  5, and Musée d'Orsay  5). Are there any series where every piece is held by a VA art museum that is not vital? -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:31, 3 July 2025 (UTC)

   Also, Roy Lichtenstein reinterpreted masterworks of several Masters. For Van Gogh, he reinterpreted this as Bedroom at Arles. So I guess he was essentially voting that this is vital.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 09:28, 3 July 2025 (UTC)

   Maybe this should be a swap for Portrait of Dr. Gachet  5 or Café Terrace at Night  5 since we already have 6 by Van Gogh.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:25, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

2. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. As a point about a work in 3 VA musuems, I have stumbled upon The Battle of San Romano which is in 3 VA museums.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 10:10, 3 July 2025 (UTC)

2. I did some research on VA3 artist in order to confirm that this is a reasonable nomination. Here is painting, sculpture and other media specific works. I see that up to 8 VAs is in the reasonable range for VA3s:
   1. Michelangelo  3 8: Sistine Chapel  4, The Creation of Adam  5, The Last Judgment (Michelangelo)  5, Sistine Chapel ceiling  5, David (Michelangelo)  4, Madonna of Bruges  5, Moses (Michelangelo)  5, Pietà (Michelangelo)  4
   2. Vincent van Gogh  3 6: Café Terrace at Night  5, The Potato Eaters  5, Portrait of Dr. Gachet  5, The Starry Night  4, Sunflowers (Van Gogh series)  5, Wheat Fields  5
   3. Leonardo da Vinci  3 6: Lady with an Ermine  5, The Last Supper (Leonardo)  4, Mona Lisa  4, Salvator Mundi (Leonardo)  5, Virgin of the Rocks  5, Vitruvian Man  5
   4. Rembrandt  3 5: The Anatomy Lesson of Dr. Nicolaes Tulp  5, The Night Watch  4, The Return of the Prodigal Son (Rembrandt)  5, Self-portraits by Rembrandt  5, The Storm on the Sea of Galilee  5
   5. Pablo Picasso  3 4: Les Demoiselles d'Avignon  4, Guernica (Picasso)  4, The Weeping Woman  5, Chicago Picasso  5
   6. N.B. Hokusai  3 only has works in the other media category at VA5 and is not listed among the sculptors and painters at VA4. Thus, he is not as comparable 3: The Dream of the Fisherman's Wife  5, Fine Wind, Clear Morning  5, The Great Wave off Kanagawa  4 -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:06, 22 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Rodin Museum

This museum is overshadowed in Paris by Louvre  4 and Musée d'Orsay  5 as well as possibly Musée National d'Art Moderne  4, but it hosts the big version of The Thinker  4, The Kiss (Rodin sculpture)  5, The Gates of Hell  5, The Burghers of Calais  5, The Mature Age  5, at least one of the Wheat Fields  5

Support

1. As nom.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:02, 3 July 2025 (UTC)
2. We could have a bit more museums Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add The Coronation of Napoleon

If there were a French Language WP VA list, this painting would probably be VA4. Prior to my tour of the Louvre last week, I showed my guide 10 items that I had identified as VA4 and VA5 that I was hoping to see that day, he took us to a room with 5 VA5 works according to ENG WP and showed us this over 3 other VA5 works I had pointed out to him. Napoleon is a monstrous larger than life subject in France. Anything associated with him is 3 times as large and twice as important as it might rightly be to someone from an English speaking country. I think we overlook this one by Jacques-Louis David  4. I don't know what other works we list by David, but this is a good one.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 19:06, 3 July 2025 (UTC)

It is an important enough work to have The Public Viewing David's 'Coronation' at the Louvre as a derivative.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:46, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nominator. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 19:15, 3 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 16:33, 6 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Based on the notable works in his infobox, i have discovered The Death of Socrates  5 and The Death of Marat  5.--TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:01, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

We also have Napoleon Crossing the Alps  5.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:04, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Eight thousander

This would probably go under Climbing  4 and with 57 other editions of this article in other Wikipedia languages, it should give some idea of how important the Eight-thousanders have been in climbing (and world) history. Two of the eight-thousanders at a level 4 being Mount Everest  4 and K2  4 and most of the other 12 are at level 5 (e.g., Annapurna  5, Manaslu  5 and Nanga Parbat  5). I think eight-thousander should also be at Leve 5?. 2001:BB6:5F0C:1500:A998:EAB9:F7AA:2133 (talk) 17:29, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nominator. 2001:BB6:5F0C:1500:A998:EAB9:F7AA:2133 (talk) 17:29, 4 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add Venus in Furs

Responsible for the naming of Masochism - right now the detiling of the cultural influence is rather poor but there's a template showing the various adaptations at least (also we could probably use more pre-20th century lit)

Support

1. As nom Iostn (talk) 16:10, 6 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Just quickly noting that some pre-20th century novels that've crossed my mind as potential additions are The Castle of Otranto, From the Earth to the Moon and The Moonstone.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 16:51, 6 July 2025 (UTC)

Add More Demi Moore

Above at #Remove_Demi's_Birthday_Suit, there were several mentions that the cultural impact of this work made it more vital than that subject. With Photography  3 being a level three subject with 33 specific works listed at Wikipedia:Vital_articles/Level/5/Arts#Photographs and Body painting  5 just being a pending nomination at VA5 and Demi's_Birthday_Suit being the only specific work of body painting it may be the case that body painting may not have sufficient vitality for individual works (as stated above by User:LaukkuTheGreit) and that photography clearly does. This work also brings together model Demi Moore  5, as photographed by Annie Leibovitz  5 for Vanity Fair (magazine)  5 and makeup by Joanne Gair  5. As User:NegativeMP1 pointed out in that nomination the clear and present cultural impact of this lends itself more to vitality determination/recognition: "It had a cultural impact by causing numerous celebrities to pose for photographs in advanced pregnancy, which has made pregnancy photos fashionable and created a profitable business for photographers such as Jennifer Loomis." The Arts remain under quota (3687/3700) so I open the floor here.

Support

1. As nominator (at the suggestions of User:ALittleClass and User:NegativeMP1).-02:20, 7 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. As far as our coverage of modern U.S. pop culture goes, I don't think this is the next cab off the rank. As of yet, its academic importance to photography appears to be limited. J947 ‡ ^edits 03:21, 7 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Not one of the top 34 or 50 most important photographs in history. Kevinishere15 (talk) 20:34, 27 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:20, 7 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Verse (poetry)

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

Much like Metre (poetry), a very fundamental concept in poetry.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 07:20, 7 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 17:49, 19 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Lazman321 (talk) 05:14, 20 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Sure. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:34, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Add Haystacks (Monet series)

According to this article, this series included the first specific impressionist work to sell for $100 million. According to the Claude Monet  4 article, this was his first series exhibited. Both articles describe this as an important series for Monet. The arts are under quota.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:29, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add Love (image)

This was the design of the 1964 Museum of Modern Art annual Christmas card and one of the most popular Xmas cards in museum history. This led to Love (Indianapolis) and then the whole List of Love sculptures.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:37, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Seems decently impactful. QuicoleJR (talk) 16:27, 10 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add art museums

Kröller-Müller Museum

Collection includes Café Terrace at Night  5, Sunflowers (Van Gogh series)  5, and 9x Wheat Fields  5.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:57, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. We could have a bit more museums Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Has world's 2nd largest collection of Van Gogh paintings.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 18:35, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

Mauritshuis

Collection includes Girl with a Pearl Earring  5, The Anatomy Lesson of Dr. Nicolaes Tulp  5, 2x Self-portraits by Rembrandt  5

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:57, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. We could have a bit more museums Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Swap Los Angeles County Museum of Art for J. Paul Getty Museum  5

Although the Getty has one of the Self-portraits by Rembrandt  5, LACMA has The Treachery of Images  5, 2x Bird in Space  5, a version of The Weeping Woman  5. Although the Getty Museum may be famously well-endowed, I am not sure its collection is the best of the museums in LA.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:57, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Support add Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose remove Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

Swap Buffalo AKG Art Museum for Art Gallery of Ontario  5

Art Gallery of Ontario is the second biggest art museum (behind the Royal Ontario Museum) in Toronto, the largest city in Canada. Neither Toronto museum hosts any vital articles of specific works. The nearest vital article of specific works to Toronto is at Buffalo AKG (100 miles away) Spirit of the Dead Watching  5.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:57, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Support add Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose adding the Buffalo AKG. _pbp 16:32, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Oppose removing Art Gallety of Ontario Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Discussion

I dont think having a single VA5 or near-VA5 work is enough to get a museum to VA5 _pbp 17:12, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

User:Purplebackpack89, Buffalo AKG formerly held Artemis and the Stag  5 in their collection for many years. Also there is an open nomination here for #Add L'Homme qui marche I.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 02:21, 22 July 2025 (UTC)

Add Musée Marmottan Monet

It hosts Impression, Sunrise  5 and at least 18 Water Lilies (Monet series)  4.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:57, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. We could have a bit more museums Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

National Archaeological Museum, Naples

The museum hosts Farnese Hercules  5 and Venus Callipyge  5.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:11, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. We could have a bit more museums Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Add L'Homme qui marche I

This is considered an iconic piece and one of the most valuable sculptures ever sold at auction. It seems that we list only one work by Alberto Giacometti.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:31, 8 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:27, 8 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Support, we have room for visual arts Makkool (talk) 18:16, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discussion

Remove "Nuthin' but a 'G' Thang"

The song "Nuthin' but a 'G' Thang" I believe shouldn't be listed as a vital article on Wikipedia. The song by Snoop Dogg and Dr. Dre shall be removed from the vital articles in my opinion because I don't feel as if it's significant enough to be listed. While the track was an iconic moment in 1990s West Coast hip-hop, its cultural impact is relatively narrow and largely confined to a specific era and region. Vital Articles at this level should represent songs with broader, more enduring global influence or historical significance. The songs importance is already well-covered through the articles of Dr. Dre and Snoop Dogg, and in the context of West Coast hip-hop. Removing it would help maintain the integrity and selectivity of the Level 5 list, ensuring it highlights truly foundational works in global music history. I also believe that "California Love" (which is already listed), "Juicy", and "Lose Yourself" are significantly more important than "Nuthin' but a 'G' Thang". JustTryingToBeSmart (talk) 05:54, 6 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. Per nomination
2. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think this is among the most important songs of all time. Also, we already list the album it's from, so that helps. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:54, 15 July 2025 (UTC)
3. It's enough we list The Chronic  5, the album this is on Makkool (talk) 18:02, 19 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Swap with Lose Yourself. The Chronic is listed, we don't need to list this too (I'd argue even Still D.R.E. is a stronger inclusion than this), and Lose Yourself is one of, if not the most recognizable and iconic rap song of all time, although that is very debatable. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:37, 25 July 2025 (UTC)
5. --Thi (talk) 15:06, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Oppose

Discuss

@JustTryingToBeSmart: This discussion should be on the new Arts and Everyday Life talk page. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:08, 14 July 2025 (UTC)

I didn't realize that page existed to be honest. Thank you for letting me know! I will move it now. JustTryingToBeSmart (talk) 20:03, 14 July 2025 (UTC)

Add If....

Influential British satire film, widely known for its imposing imagery and for launching Malcolm McDowell  5's acting career. We also only list two entirely British productions (Monty Python and the Holy Grail  5 and Monty Python's Life of Brian  5). It's also on WikiProject Film's core list.

Support

1. As nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 04:19, 17 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. Has already been nominated by the same person earlier on the page in a bundled nomination. Please close either this proposal on the earlier one. Duplicate proposals can cause problems. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:20, 17 July 2025 (UTC)

Featured article review for Age of Empires

I have nominated Age of Empires for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets the featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" in regards to the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. ~~ AirshipJungleman29 (talk) 09:52, 21 July 2025 (UTC)

Add In the Hall of the Mountain King

Iconic classical composition and popular culture staple not listed. Would go under Peer Gynt (Grieg)  5.

Support

1. As nom. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 07:41, 22 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Iconic. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:13, 23 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Yes. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 01:37, 25 July 2025 (UTC)
4. Lazman321 (talk) 15:32, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Distribution of VA5 specific works across artists

I was looking at the distribution of VA5 specific works of painting, sculpture and other media across artists as an indicator as to whether we have artists at the right level and whether their specific works seem to line up with these rankings. Here are some things that I have noticed:

• Among those listed as an artist at VA3 artist, the distribution of VA5 specific works of painting, sculpture and other media is as follows: Michelangelo  3 8, Vincent van Gogh  3 6, Leonardo da Vinci  3 6, Rembrandt  3 5, Pablo Picasso  3 4, Hokusai  3 3. Since Hokusai is the only one of these not listed among painters and sculptors at VA4, that is not a worry. I am wondering if we have evaluated Picasso correctly (at VA3 or with only 4 VA5s), probably more the latter than the former.
• There are 5 VA4 sculptors and painters with 4 VA5 works (Auguste Rodin  4, Francisco Goya  4, Gian Lorenzo Bernini  4, James McNeill Whistler  4, Marcel Duchamp  4). Should any of them be at VA3 or have fewer works listed.
• There are 4 VA5 sculptors and painters with 2 VA5 works (Gustav Klimt  5, Thomas Gainsborough  5, Roy Lichtenstein  5, Jeff Koons  5). Should any of them be at VA4 or have fewer works listed.
• There are 7 VA4 sculptors and painters with no VA5 works. (Joseph Beuys  4, Antoine Watteau  4, Camille Pissarro  4, Henri de Toulouse-Lautrec  4, Wassily Kandinsky  4, Marc Chagall  4, Gerhard Richter  4). Should they be at VA4 or have a work listed (probably more the latter than the former)?

Comments welcome-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 09:54, 22 July 2025 (UTC)

• One other thing. Among VA4 sculptors and painters, the only one with no painting or sculpture VAs but with other media VAs is Albrecht Dürer  4 with Knight, Death and the Devil  5 and Melencolia I  5.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 11:30, 22 July 2025 (UTC)

VA4 artists without any VA works

At WP:VA4 1 of the 10 sculptors (Joseph Beuys  4) and 6 of the 63 painters (Antoine Watteau  4, Camille Pissarro  4, Henri de Toulouse-Lautrec  4, Wassily Kandinsky  4, Marc Chagall  4, Gerhard Richter  4) have no specific works listed as among the vital specific works of paintings, sculptures and other media. I am testing the waters with a few specific works to see if people feel they are VA worthy:

Add The Embarkation for Cythera

Of the works listed in the templates for these artists this has the most interwikis (20).

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:06, 24 July 2025 (UTC)
2. --Thi (talk) 15:05, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Oppose

Discuss

Add At the Moulin Rouge

Aside from the nomination above the only other work with more than 10 interwikis (14).

I should add that when I was in Paris last month. I took a Viator "Montmartre Paris Guided Walking Tour" with Moulin Rouge as its first stop. The tour guide who has lived in the Montmartre neighborhood for about 10 years carried a printed copy of this work to show us and then a stop on the tour included a restaurant that hangs a print of this work on the wall. Apparently, this work is a point of pride for the locals of that famous neighborhood in Paris. On the other hand, this work is not one of the 12 that the Art Institute of Chicago includes in its self-guided essentials tour in its own app.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:42, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:06, 24 July 2025 (UTC)
2. --Thi (talk) 15:05, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Oppose

Discuss

Add I and the Village

Of the remaining artists, this is the only article that exists from 100 Great Paintings.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 06:24, 24 July 2025 (UTC)
2. --Thi (talk) 15:05, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Oppose

Discuss

Add The Old Guitarist

One of Picasso's most famous works. Considering Picasso arguably needs more works listed, I'm surprised this hasn't been added yet.

Support

1. As nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:16, 25 July 2025 (UTC)
2. On Saturday, I visited the Art Institute of Chicago and spent some time on the self guided 12 stop essentials tour in the app. This is one of the 12 works that the AIC thinks is its most essential to see.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:33, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Boating Party

Because Gustave Caillebotte  5 was from a wealthy family, he had no urgency regarding selling his works and bequeathed about 175 of his works to his brother. As an artist, Caillebotte's own vitality lagged well behind the Impressionists that he supported financially by collecting their works. Most of his works did not enter the public domain until his brother's daughter advanced in age and the family began selling off works in the 1950s and 1960s. While working on Boating Party and reading about the importance of this work to the culture of France (upon its acquisition, it was announced that it would tour france and then be part of a major exhibition, which had stops in Los Angeles and Chicago), I want to nominate it. Caillebotte is VA5, As more people are learning about his story, his importance and notability is rising. He currently only has one VA work (Paris Street; Rainy Day). By my count currently, a few VA5 painters and sculptors have 2 VA-listed works (Lichtenstein, Klimt, Koons and Gainsborough). In recent years, this and Young Man at His Window have been transferred from private collections to public-serving museums. I expect that the importance of these two works will rise as they become more familiar to the public.

Support

1. As nominator.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 17:38, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Oppose

Discuss

Add Tetris (Game Boy video game)

Despite its industry and cultural impact and being one of the few video game-related articles (and technically the only video game) to be at level 4, no specific version of Tetris  4 is currently listed at level 5. For comparison, Mario  4 has Mario Kart  5, Super Mario Bros.  5, and Super Mario 64  5; Pokémon  4 has Pokémon Red, Blue, and Yellow  5 and Pokémon Go  5; and Final Fantasy  4 has Final Fantasy VII  5.

I feel like Tetris deserves to have a version listed at this level, and I feel the Game Boy version is the most obvious choice. It is the most commercially successful version of Tetris  4 and one of the best-selling video games of all time at 35 million. Furthermore, by Nintendo bundling the Game Boy with Tetris, the game became the Game Boy's killer app, the success of which helped establish Nintendo's dominance in the handheld gaming industry, while making Tetris the cultural phenomenon it is today. [4][5][6]

Should be listed at Wikipedia:Vital articles/Level/5/Everyday life/Sports, games and recreation#European products under Tetris. Lazman321 (talk) 18:07, 25 July 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nom Lazman321 (talk) 18:07, 25 July 2025 (UTC)
2. I could go either way between the Game Boy or the NES versions but I'm going with the Game Boy version because I think the popularity and standards of it are more or less what characterized Tetris in public perception (mainly with the "Tetris theme"). λ NegativeMP1 01:47, 29 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Both the NES and Game Boy versions are important, but I'm going with the Game Boy, seeing as how it was the pack-in title for it and was one of the best-selling on the system. It's part of what made the system and by extension portable gaming so popular, so I think it belongs as not just for the popularity of Tetris, but also of the Game Boy. AllyWithInfo (talk) 05:24, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. Oppose, but suggest adding Tetris (NES video game) instead: NES Tetris nowadays is both more well-known than the Game Boy version and has far more long-term significance with its competitive scene. While we should definitely have at least one version of Tetris included, the Game Boy version, despite its popularity, is not the best choice. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 16:36, 26 July 2025 (UTC)
2. What differs this from Tetris  4 to make it vital? Just because Tetris is VA4 doesn't mean we have to include a subtopic at VA5. I would much rather adding a completely different video game, because there's so much more that can be written about it. J947 ‡ ^edits 00:36, 6 August 2025 (UTC)

Discussion

Add Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare

Call of Duty  5 is one of the biggest video game franchises ever, and one that I have always felt deserved a sub-topic at VA. I mean, we have The Legend of Zelda  5 and Mario (franchise)  5 with 3 sub-topics, and other similarly sized franchises as Call of Duty like Grand Theft Auto  5 have two. Call of Duty is undoubtedly the biggest franchise we list that doesn't have a sub-topic, and it should have one, probably even two if we use GTA as a benchmark, although whatever that second one could be is definitely a hard sell so it's better to focus on one (for what it is worth, my personal vote for a second sub-topic would actually be MW2). The game that makes the most sense as a sub-topic is obvious though.

Modern Warfare is universally considered to be the important game in the franchise, and one of the most important games of the seventh generation of video game consoles. The article as it is right now doesn't exactly do it many favors, but it's frequently considered one of the greatest games of all time (look at List of video games considered the best and see how many references its entry has), had a multiplayer mode that changed online video games forever, and a story arc that carried over into a trilogy that, with subsequent entries, also broke several records. Even outside of the trilogy, the standards set by Modern Warfare and the fans it brought in carried throughout the entire franchise. In-fact, it was so successful and important, that when the franchise started going through the slightest bit of a drought, remastering the original game and then later rebooting the story arc was what saved it. Even nowadays, the original game has almost 30,000 monthly page views and 55 interwikis, stats higher than many video games we currently list. Also, Sports, games and recreation is 25 entries under quota (in-fact, the entirety of Everyday life is under quota overall), so we have room.

Support

1. As nom. λ NegativeMP1 01:46, 29 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Most important game in a very popular franchise. Lazman321 (talk) 19:01, 30 July 2025 (UTC)
3. Practically every FPS made after CoD 4 shows some of its DNA. Johnnie Runner (talk) 20:06, 02 August 2025 (UTC)
4. Video games are IMO underrepresented among vital articles, and Modern Warfare seems like a decent addition, although I'm hesitant to add a subentry for a VA5 series. QuicoleJR (talk) 02:20, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Tetris (NES video game)

Tetris  4 is a video game that I feel should be represented at this level through a specific version. In my previous proposal for the Game Boy version, someone suggested that the NES version should be added instead. While I stand by my original proposal, I suppose it's only fair to also propose this version as well.

While it isn't as commercially successful as the Game Boy version, it is nonetheless successful in its own right, having sold 8 million copies according to a BBC documentary. It was the end result of a major court case involving Nintendo and Atari Games, and is arguably the second-most iconic version of Tetris. However, perhaps the most obvious cultural impact of this specific version is its high-level play. There is a significant community of players, often adolescent as covered by the press, that have pioneered expert techniques in playing the NES version in order to maximize their score and levels in this game, to the point that some have play it both to the point of crashing it and to the point of rolling the level counter past its integer overflow. Through these techniques, these players have competed in the Classic Tetris World Championship, a popular esports competition whose inaugural tournament was the subject of the documentary Ecstasy of Order: The Tetris Masters.

Support

1. As nom Lazman321 (talk) 19:21, 30 July 2025 (UTC)
2. Definitely. Æ's old account wasn't working (talk) 02:04, 1 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

1. What differs this from Tetris  4 to make it vital? I'm not convinced that the endgame differences anywhere near justify taking an extra slot up. Heck, it has 4 interwikis and the article was created in 2019. Just because Tetris is VA4 doesn't mean we have to include a subtopic at VA5. I would much rather adding a completely different video game, because there's so much more that can be written about it. J947 ‡ ^edits 00:38, 6 August 2025 (UTC)

Neutral

Add Prometheus

An important figure in mythology. The Prometheus myth is well-known and common knowledge. Should be considered a vital mythological figure.

Support

1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:12, 31 July 2025 (UTC)
2. --LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 16:44, 31 July 2025 (UTC)
3. --Thi (talk) 11:56, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Mother (video game series)

Includes EarthBound Beginnings, Earthbound, and Mother 3. Many of these video games are acclaimed as some of the best of all time, they have spawned a fandom of considerable size, and the character of Ness is well known outside of Earthbound.

Support

1. As nom. ALittleClass (talk) 17:16, 31 July 2025 (UTC)
2. This is the gaming equivalent to many less-iconic films we list for their critical acclaim as among the greatest, but I'm not sure how many of those we should list. Regardless, the series is extremely popular in Japan and Ness has a decent amount of cultural relevance, so I will support this. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:12, 3 August 2025 (UTC)
3. I would prefer to add EarthBound over the series itself since it's far and away the most influential entry, but the latter is still a sensible addition considering that the fan translation of Mother 3 is possibly the greatest example of fan collaboration for a video game. Johnnie Runner (talk) 20:49, 03 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Half-Life 2

Since Half-Life (video game)  5 is already at Level 5, it might seem like bloat to have two individual entries instead of just listing Half-Life (series), but I think this is a rare case where the parts are greater than the whole. Half-Life 2 did for the next generation what Half-Life 1 did for the previous: set a new standard for game physics and 3D modelling/character animation, as well as immediately becoming a modding juggernaut (check out List of Source engine mods and List of video games derived from mods, look at how many of them are built off of Half-Life 1 & 2).

Support

1. Johnnie Runner (talk) 21:36, 02 August 2025 (UTC)
2. Weak support. Article doesn't do it much favors but Half-Life 2 was very influential in level design and storytelling. I can see both Half-Life and Half-Life 2 warranting being here. And I don't think having only the series here really works. λ NegativeMP1 20:07, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

1. If this passes should we add Portal 2 as well? Kevinishere15 (talk) 07:53, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

   I think we should swap Portal (video game)  5 with Portal (series), because both Portal games are equally important, but unlike Half-Life, Portal does not warrant two entries. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:38, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

   I actually think we should keep Portal 1 over the series. What makes Portal especially notable is the sheer originality of the concept and humor, which kind of by-definition is unique to the first game. If we were going to swap Portal 1 for an umbrella entry, we might consider The Orange Box, since that includes not just the principal release of Portal (video game)  5 but also Team Fortress 2, which has its own arguments for Level 5. Johnnie Runner (talk) 17:37, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

   The Orange Box would, imo, be effectively a non-entry. It's obviously a very significant release to gaming history, but the compilation itself isn't as important as any of its entries. We'd be worsening the coverage of Portal and Half-Life 2 - not improving it. As for Team Fortress 2, it used to be listed, but it got removed in a discussion last year when we cracked down on a bunch of video game listings. In retrospect, I'm not sure if I'd support readding it. Probably not.

   As for adding Portal 2 straight up... I'm not seeing it. Yes, it was critically acclaimed, but there are several games we don't list that received similar levels of critical acclaim. Portal at least left some impact on the gaming industry. I don't really know if Portal 2 did. λ NegativeMP1 20:05, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Add Prince of Persia

With the amount of video game subentry addition proposals (besides Mother) I thought I'd make a more diversifying one.

Prince of Persia is a well known name in video games, getting more pageviews than the others being proposed (including the not-proposed EarthBound, the most significant entry in the Mother series, although CoD4 has most views if you extend the timeframe further back). Long-running series which has still gotten new entries recently, and has influenced the medium - Tomb Raider  5 and Assassin's Creed  5 have taken inspiration from it, and it invented the cinematic platformer subgenre. Two entries appear in List of video games considered the best. Has a Britannica article. Used to be listed early on but was perhaps overly hastily voted off in a mass purge of VA5 video game listings.

Support

1. As nom.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 08:42, 3 August 2025 (UTC)
2. Video games have been around roughly as long as television shows and have a similar amount of cultural and financial importance, so they should get a similar amount of representation, and I don't believe we need to cut many more TV shows. This franchise is certainly popular and influential enough to warrant listing. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:03, 3 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Halloween (1978 film)

One of the most iconic and influential horror films, starting a very successful franchise. It popularized the Slasher film  5 genre and pioneered many of its tropes. It also received a lot of critical acclaim, being considered by many critics to be the best slasher film and one of the best films of all time. Additionally, Michael Myers (Halloween) is one of the most iconic horror villains of all time, and could arguably be considered a vital character himself. 53 interwikis, rated Top-Importance by the WikiProjects for Horror and for American cinema.

Support

1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:36, 3 August 2025 (UTC)
2. I feel like when it comes to representing horror films this one is a no-brainer. λ NegativeMP1 19:56, 3 August 2025 (UTC)
3. Bluevestman (talk) 20:27, 3 August 2025 (UTC)
4. Absolutely. AllyWithInfo (talk) 18:31, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Neutral

Discuss

Add Dracula (1931 English-language film)

The most famous Dracula adaptation, well-entrenched in pop culture. Most significant appearance of Bela Lugosi  5. Concerns against addition would be overlap with other Dracula topics but let's see what you think.

Support

1. As nom.--LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 14:21, 4 August 2025 (UTC)
2. Had a major impact on all future portrayals of Dracula  4 and was the start of Universal's iconic line of monster films. It has also received a lot of critical acclaim. A slot at Level 5 is warranted. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:32, 4 August 2025 (UTC)
3. Weak support, we already list Tod Browning  5 and Bela Lugosi  5, and it's definitely less important than Nosferatu  5 as far as vampire movies go. But its important enough to list as a symbol of pop culture horror and the Universal Monster movies, as well as its direction and production design being a further influence on Horror film  5. If we list Frankenstein (1931 film)  5 then I think it fits. AllyWithInfo (talk) 18:44, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss

Add Leshan Giant Buddha

Largest stone Buddha statue and largest pre-modern statue in the world, UNESCO heritage site. Zinderboff (talk) 05:55, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Support

1. As nom. Zinderboff (talk) 06:43, 5 August 2025 (UTC)

Oppose

Discuss