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Add Colony  5

PASSED
Added 5-0. Makkool (talk) 17:17, 22 October 2024 (UTC)

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There are lots of colonies to this day.

Support
  1. As nominator. To geography basics. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 12:25, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. --LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 13:40, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Level 4 article. The Blue Rider 17:08, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 14:41, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  5. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Some post-Soviet regions

Add Central Federal District  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 18:11, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

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It has by far the highest population (40m+) and GDP (~566b) of Russia's federal districts. Should most certainly be at V4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. Strong support as nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Interstellarity (talk) 11:32, 31 May 2024 (UTC)
  4. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 02:37, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Moscow Oblast  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:30, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

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Major component of the Moscow metropolitan area with a population of ~8.5m and a GDP of $72 billion. Most certainly more vital than the vast majority of the republics. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:49, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:10, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Krasnodar Krai  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:30, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

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The Kuban is a culturally distinct region of Russia with a population of ~5.8m. and a GDP of $35 billion. Most certainly more vital than the vast majority of the republics. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:49, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Donbas  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 12:12, 7 May 2024 (UTC)

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A historically relevant region of Ukraine that only became more relevant during the Russo-Ukrainian War  5. 3 of the 24 Ukrainian cities we list are located in the region and so was one-seventh of the pre-war population. I'd probably support this at V4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support per nom. Gizza (talk) 01:47, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:02, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  4. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:24, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion

Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:18, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

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Add Cisleithania and Lands of the Crown of Saint Stephen

WITHDRAWN
No interest. Makkool (talk) 18:19, 12 November 2024 (UTC)

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The Austrian and Hungarian sides of Austria-Hungary  4 respectively. Add under History.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:35, 20 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Battle of Guilford Court House  5

PASSED
Added 4–1. No consensus as to what to swap this with. Makkool (talk) 17:08, 16 November 2024 (UTC)

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The American Revolutionary War  4 could definitely use more than 3 battles when the Civil War has 16. This battle had major effects on the war, led to the Siege of Yorktown  5 which ended the war, became the first American Revolution battle to have its battlefield preserved by the National Park Service, and it even has a town in New Hampshire named after it!

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 15:51, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support as a swap with some Civil War battle, 16 is way too many. Oppose otherwise. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 03:11, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
    Which battle would you suggest removing? QuicoleJR (talk) 13:56, 2 March 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support add, can't say which Civil War battle should be cut Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 18:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. 16 Civil War battles is too many but the Civil War was still fought on a greater order of magnitude than the American Revolutionary War. (The biggest Civil War battles killed more than the entire Revolution). And if we added another American Revolutionary War battle, I'd add Trenton or Brandywine before this one. pbp 12:51, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Trinity (nuclear test)  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 16:24, 20 November 2024 (UTC)

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Important subtopic of the Manhattan Project. Interstellarity (talk) 13:42, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. Interstellarity (talk) 13:42, 23 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Manhattan Project  4 is Level 4, so we could spare a subtopic. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:45, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Causes of World War I  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:55, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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Covers several events that may not be vital in themselves but together are quite important, such as the First Moroccan Crisis, the Bosnian Crisis, the Agadir Crisis, and the Anglo-German naval arms race. It is ranked Top Importance by WikiProject European History, same as Causes of World War II  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 18:51, 14 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. We list Causes of World War II, may support Causes of the Great Depression. Interstellarity (talk) 00:48, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. It's needed. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:11, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
  1. How many war causation articles are at VA?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:17, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Hallstatt

Last comment 27 days ago. Removed 4-0. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:28, 11 November 2024 (UTC)

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It's pretty and it receives a disproportionate amount of tourists relative to its size, but it's ultimately a small village settlement.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 16:05, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. (We already list Salzkammergut  5.) Makkool (talk) 17:19, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per Makkool. Hallstadt culture and its associated UNESCO site are vital; the hamlet of Hallstadt is not pbp 00:00, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:00, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove San Cristóbal de La Laguna

Last comment 30 days ago. Removed 4-0. QuicoleJR (talk) 14:47, 25 November 2024 (UTC)

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Tenerife  5 (pop. 949k) does not need two settlements listed. Plus, San Cristóbal de La Laguna is less than 10km from Santa Cruz de Tenerife  5), the capital and largest city of the island.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 16:16, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 19:49, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:06, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Dominican War of Independence  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:44, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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Led to the creation of the Dominican Republic  4. Unique among Latin American wars of Independence, as this was fought against Haiti.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:44, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makes sense. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:25, 18 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 14:22, 21 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 22:31, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Athenian democracy  5

PASSED
Added 5-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:44, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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The prototypical Ancient Greek democratic city-state.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 17:40, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. reasonable addition Aurangzebra (talk) 20:57, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. The first government to be called a democracy. An easy add. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 22:08, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. Important. The Blue Rider 14:09, 1 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Trojan Horse  5

PASSED
Added 7-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:43, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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Famous weapon of the Trojan War. Maybe better filed under Greek Mythology.

Support
  1. As nominator. To history. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 17:29, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. --LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 17:37, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 20:54, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. Per nom. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 22:06, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  6. Support, but file under Mythological items. Makkool (talk) 11:29, 17 September 2024 (UTC)
  7. SupportGeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:49, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Swap Bratsk with Novokuznetsk  5

PASSED
Swapped 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:43, 30 November 2024 (UTC)

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Bratsk is already covered by Irkutsk  5 and Irkutsk Oblast  5. Novokuznetsk, on the other hand, is a major coal mining and industrial centre and has the 16th highest GMP of all Russian cities. Up until recently, it had a higher population than Kemerovo  5. It feels odd excluding it from a list of 6 cities in the Siberian Federal District, let alone 12. Compared to Bratsk, Novo has slightly more interwikis, double the English and Russian pageviews, and 2.4 times the population. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:27, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:27, 18 March 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Bratsk has 53 daily page views, which quite low. Makkool (talk) 12:19, 12 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support swap. Interstellarity (talk) 23:08, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Nothing with 53 daily views should be vital. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 00:33, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Third batch of history removals

Remove History of Svalbard

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:41, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

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Features some interesting stories about Arctic exploration, but home to only 2,500 people.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove American automobile industry in the 1950s

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:41, 24 September 2024 (UTC)

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Another interesting article, archetypal of postwar industry in many ways, but too narrow in my opinion.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove History of Franconia

PASSED
Removed 5-0, swapped with Franconia. Makkool (talk) 10:20, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

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Since we don’t list Franconia. Has some coverage from History of Bavaria  5. Just 3 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support swap with Franconia  5, which definitely should be listed. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 13:05, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Swap with Franconia pbp 16:42, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. support swap. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. support swap with Franconia Makkool (talk) 20:30, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove History of Guernsey and History of Jersey

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 10:20, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

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These already have some coverage from the History of the British Isles  5 article. Minor regions of the U.K.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 03:50, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove 2011–2015 Myanmar political reforms

PASSED
Removed 4–0. Makkool (talk) 19:38, 29 November 2024 (UTC)

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These reforms were rolled back devastatingly after the 2021 Myanmar coup d'état  5. I would put these reforms on the same level as the failed Sudanese transition to democracy (2019–2021), which we voted to remove recently. Low pageviews and interwikis suggest this period is not yet well-defined.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. No lasting impact. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:55, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Iran–United States relations

PASSED
Removed 5-0. PrimalMustelid (talk) 16:48, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

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This provides a convenient summary of conflicts between nations but isn’t technically a “History” article. It is the only “country relations” entry we list.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:53, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:47, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove History of monorail

PASSED
Removed 6-0. PrimalMustelid (talk) 16:48, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

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Minor article in the History of rail transport  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Not every VA4 topic needs its history listed. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:56, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:53, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  6. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:48, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Danish colonization of the Americas

PASSED
Removed 5-0. PrimalMustelid (talk) 16:48, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

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I think this falls under interesting but not vital. Keep in mind we have Danish overseas colonies  5 and Danish Realm  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. I could see arguments for including Danish West Indies, but we don't need this overview page when all they had over there was that and Greenland. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:39, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:53, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Death of Azaria Chamberlain

PASSED
Removed 4-0. Makkool (talk) 10:20, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

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Since we voted to remove Killing of JonBenét Ramsey, I was wondering what you think of this one.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:01, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 03:51, 5 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:40, 7 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makkool (talk) 20:32, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Continental Europe  5

PASSED
Added 4-0, 1 neutral. Makkool (talk) 17:19, 27 November 2024 (UTC)

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Major geographical region and term. Rated Top-Importance in Wikiproject Geography.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:07, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Seems important enough to include. QuicoleJR (talk) 21:13, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 21:45, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. pbp 02:05, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
  1. As a geographer I'm torn on this. I don't actually believe in the myth of a European Continent, and think the region is a cultural gradient without a hard boundary, and that geologically Europe is a Peninusla. The term has historical and political significance, but I'd rather another article be included. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:14, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add all 7 geographical regions of Türkiye

Türkiye and Iran have comparable populations, but Iran gets over twice as many cities as Türkiye. Iran also has all but two of its provinces and Türkiye has NOTHING under country subdivisions? The geographical regions of Turkey are definitely all vital at this level. The articles in question are:

We should have a bit more from Türkiye, but this is just a start. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Add Aegean Region

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 10.5m. Largest city is İzmir  4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Black Sea Region

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 7.7m. Largest city is Samsun  5. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Central Anatolia Region

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 12.9m. Largest city is Ankara  4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Eastern Anatolia Region

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 6.5m. Largest city is Van, Turkey  5. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Marmara Region

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 19:30, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 26.7m. Largest city is Istanbul  3. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Mediterranean Region, Turkey

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 10.6m. Largest city is Antalya  4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Southeastern Anatolia Region

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Population ~ 8.6m. Largest city is Urfa  5. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:05, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:07, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:50, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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General discussion

  1. Not sure I am comfortable adding these as a group.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:25, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
    I will reformat my proposal. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 21:36, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

Add Cappadocia  5 (not OP)

Added 4-0. starship.paint (RUN) 10:35, 2 August 2024 (UTC)

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We should list some of the historical regions as well. Cappadocia definitely, as its still relevant today and a popular tourist destination. Place under Central Anatolia Region.

Support
  1. As nom.Makkool (talk) 12:22, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 12:45, 19 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Hanif Al Husaini (talk) 04:27, 29 April 2024 (UTC)
  4. J947 ‡ edits 22:54, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add East Thrace  5 (not OP)

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:12, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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The part of Turkey that's in Europe. Place under Marmara Region.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 12:29, 14 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Has a higher population than Belgium. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 12:47, 14 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 18:21, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:49, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Bessarabia  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 11:09, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Currently we list Banat, Galicia, Pomerania and Silesia. Bessarabia is another historical region of Europe with relevance in the modern day.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:20, 5 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Decided to land on this side. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 23:54, 20 April 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:46, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:48, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
  1. I would support historical regions like this, but it's really just Moldova  4 with Transnistria  4 traded for Budjak and part of Chernivtsi Oblast  5. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:56, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
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Add Languedoc  5 and Midi-Pyrénées  5

PASSED
Both added 4 or 5 to 0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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All of the pre-2016 regions of France should have representation imo. These were the two regions that were merged into Occitania  5 in 2016. Languedoc in particular was kept at V4 for an extended amount of time during the cull. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:21, 10 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:21, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 00:52, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. Support Languedoc-Roussillon NOT Languedoc and support Midi-Pyrénées. Languedoc-Roussillon was the region that was merged to form Occitania. Languedoc is the historical province. Languedoc-Roussillon has 102 interwikis, Languedoc only has 52 interwikis. Aurangzebra (talk) 19:10, 20 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Jiaxing  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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One of four Tier 2 Chinese cities to not be V5. Located in Zhejiang  4. 45 interwikis. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:38, 5 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:38, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. And support the other three Tier 2 cities as well. China is underrepresented relative to its population pbp 23:50, 5 June 2024 (UTC)
    @Purplebackpack89: May I copy your support for the other three, which I have proposed below? Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:38, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
    Certainly pbp 01:07, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. China is still under-represented Makkool (talk) 21:31, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Taizhou, Zhejiang  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Per my nominations above. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:34, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:34, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Adding User:Purplebackpack89 per his vote at Jiangxi at 23:50 Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:43, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. China is still under-represented Makkool (talk) 21:31, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:51, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Jiujiang  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Per my nominations above. Note that Jiangxi  5 only has Nanchang  4. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:36, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Adding User:Purplebackpack89 per his vote at Jiangxi at 23:50 Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 01:44, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. China is still under-represented Makkool (talk) 21:31, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Tripolitania  5 and Cyrenaica  5

PASSED
Both added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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If we have as many Libyan cities as we do, then we can most certainly make room for these. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:51, 6 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 00:51, 6 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 16:23, 16 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:51, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Weimar  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Surprising omission under Cities. Definitely the most important city in Thuringia. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 02:34, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 02:34, 7 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Influential philosophically and politically, the birthplace of the Weimar Republic  5. The Blue Rider 00:43, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:51, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Jacobitism  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Major political movement in Great Britain. Cause many a headache for the British government due to foreign support and Irish nationalist undertones.

Support
  1. SailorGardevoir (talk) 06:32, 28 June 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Seems like it used to be pretty important. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:11, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. pbp 19:14, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Pax Britannica  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Period of relative peace between the Great Powers. Important concept for International relations (1814–1919)  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:30, 11 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Yes. The Blue Rider 00:45, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:56, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Indo-Pakistani wars

PASSED
Added 5–0. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Though I would support listing the four major wars fought between 1947 and 1999 (we only have the Indo-Pakistani war of 1971  5), this is a convenient grouping for one of the longest-lasting conflicts of the modern era.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:30, 11 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:56, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 22:58, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Split of Christianity and Judaism  5

Passed. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 22:49, 11 December 2024 (UTC) ꧁Zanahary꧂ 22:49, 11 December 2024 (UTC)

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A very significant historical process that gave rise to the Abrahamic complex of religions. Essential for the history of Christianity  3 and of Judaism  3.

Support
  1. As nom. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 19:13, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 13:13, 2 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Seems pretty important. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:14, 18 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Southwest Papua

FAILED
Added 3-2. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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It's the only Indonesian province that is not listed here. IDBLWK (talk) 05:52, 3 September 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. IDBLWK (talk) 05:53, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 17:52, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Recentism, it has yet to be two years since it split off from West Papua. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:34, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per Ohnoitsvileplume. The Blue Rider 19:39, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add Belt and Road Initiative  5

PASSED
Added 6-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:42, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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A centerpiece of Chinese foreign policy, unprecedented in scope and magnitude of investment.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:40, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 03:05, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. Kevinishere15 (talk) 03:23, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  5. Important, perhaps level 4. The Blue Rider 14:09, 1 October 2024 (UTC)
  6. pbp 16:15, 1 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Battle of Chaeronea (338 BC)

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:42, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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Philip II of Macedon's victory over the Greek city-states. Led to the rise of Macedonian dominance in the Ancient Greek world.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 17:29, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Though I've never heard of this battle, high importance in the Classical Greece and Rome project (on the same level as Socrates and amphitheater) seems to indicate importance. Aurangzebra (talk) 20:59, 14 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Council of Trent

PASSED
Added 4-0. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 13:45, 22 November 2024 (UTC)

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One of the most important events of the Counter-Reformation  4. It shaped the trajectory of the Catholic Church for the future, solidifying its doctrines and practices.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 16:55, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 18:51, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Very important. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:04, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Hans Island

FAILED
Not added 2-3. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Physical Geography is well under the quota, so we have room for more articles there. This island was famously the subject of a decades-long dispute between Canada and Denmark, which ended in them splitting it down the middle, creating a land border between the two. 42 interwikis, rated High-Importance by WikiProject Greenland.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:03, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 08:34, 10 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Meh, more like an interesting historical trivia than vital. The Blue Rider 22:00, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per bluerider. Kevinishere15 (talk) 06:26, 10 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per BlueRider. It's uninhabited and not particularly large. pbp 16:43, 11 December 2024 (UTC)
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Siena  5

FAILED
Not removed 2-2. Makkool (talk) 10:51, 18 December 2024 (UTC)

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Siena is the 12th largest city in the region by number of inhabitants, with a population of 53,062 as of 2022. Certainly one of the smaller places we list.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 16:02, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Italy is over-represented. The city has historical importance, but in my opinion it's not by itself enough to be listed as vital. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Historically significant. More to city vitality than population alone. pbp 16:09, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per above Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Swedish colonies in the Americas

PASSED
Removed 4–0. Kevinishere15 (talk) 18:24, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

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For similar reasons to the above removal of the equivalent article for the Danish. Sweden's American colonies were few and they were short-lived, and Swedish overseas colonies  5 is also only VA5, so this article does not need to be listed.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:49, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 15:00, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:27, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:04, 4 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Late modern period  4

PASSED
Added 5–0. Makkool (talk) 11:16, 10 December 2024 (UTC)

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Rated Top-importance to the History Wikiproject. To be paired with Early modern period  2.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 17:50, 22 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Was removed from all levels and should be returned to V3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 03:39, 23 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom and ohno. Kevinishere15 (talk) 08:36, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. ibid. --Hoben7599 (talk) 14:46, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:24, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Remove Pisa  5

WITHDRAWN
Withdrawn by nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 03:19, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

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The Leaning Tower of Pisa  4 is vital; the city itself (pop. 99k) is not.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 16:06, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Historically significant. More to city vitality than population alone. pbp 16:09, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per pbp; birthplace of Republic of Pisa  5. The Blue Rider 19:38, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Weak oppose; Tuscany may be overrepresented, but as some have stated, it is much more than its tower and is not the first Italian city I would remove. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:04, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per above Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  5. Even just on the basis of being an extremely popular tourist destination alone, this deserves to be here (I will die on the hill that popular tourist spots should be considered for VA5 even if the town itself is low in population). Aurangzebra (talk) 22:28, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Remove Giugliano in Campania

PASSED
Removed 5–0. Makkool (talk) 08:58, 19 December 2024 (UTC)

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A not particularly large (pop. 124k) suburb of Naples  4.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 16:08, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 16:10, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  5. per nom, strange inclusion Aurangzebra (talk) 16:10, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Lower Manhattan and Midtown Manhattan

FAILED
Not added 1-3. Makkool (talk) 10:16, 21 December 2024 (UTC)

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Lower Manhattan is the historical birthplace of New York City  3 and for its first 225 years was the entirety of the city. Midtown Manhattan is the largest central business district in the world, and has been ranked as the densest central business district in the world.

Support
As nominator. Note that we list Chicago Loop  5. feminist🩸 (talk) 09:37, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  1. Support Midtown as a swap with Wall Street  5, which often refers to a metonym of Financial District. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 01:22, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Similar to the reasons I opposed Manhattan  5 --> 4 (It was proposed but no consensus to do it). Manhattan itself is currently VA5, do we need MULTIPLE articles on Manhattan (itself a part of New York City) at this level? Isn't much of what's in Lower and Midtown Manhattan somewhat redundant to Manhattan and New York City? And I as I said with Manhattan up to 4, are Manhattan/Lower Manhattan/Midtown Manhattan so gosh darn important that they get multiple vital articles while the dozens of American cities we've removed from VA5 in the past year or so get none? pbp 12:43, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
    are Manhattan/Lower Manhattan/Midtown Manhattan so gosh darn important that they get multiple vital articles while the dozens of American cities we've removed from VA5 in the past year or so get none? Yes, unironically. The importance of New York City – especially for international readers – is next level compared to many (if not most) American "cities" which are mostly just a small number of tall buildings surrounded by lots of single-family housing. Either of Midtown or Lower Manhattan would far exceed many American cities we removed by daytime population, economic output, and number of notable landmarks. feminist🩸 (talk) 00:48, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
    What about the rest of what I said, like the redundancy part? pbp 16:49, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per pbp. Lower Manhattan and Midtown Manhattan are completely redundant to Manhattan  5 and to a lesser extent Wall Street  5. It made sense to include all the 5 boroughs of NYC since they have very distinct cultures, histories, and urban geographies (they basically feel like 5 different cities combined into one). But Lower Manhattan and Midtown Manhattan are completely subsumed by Manhattan. I can anecdotally back this up because I currently live in NYC (and lived for a year in Lower Manhattan). Aurangzebra (talk) 22:20, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:49, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
Mixed
Discuss

On second thoughts, I no longer support this, mainly per Aurangzebra. I can't formally withdraw this nomination because OhnoitsvileplumeXD has supported, but I am retracting my support vote. feminist🩸 (talk) 02:56, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

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Swap Saint-Denis, Seine-Saint-Denis  5 for Trier

NO CONSENSUS
No consensus, 1-1, with no votes in a month and a half

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Saint-Denis is a suburb of Paris that has a high population and appears to be a major part of Paris, but isn't really that notable by itself other than having a couple of landmarks, and in all honesty I am not sure what its doing here. Trier is relatively small population-wise, but is a city of great historical and cultural importance, with many important historical events having taken place here.

Support
  1. As nom Iostn (talk) 18:29, 19 October 2024 (UTC)


Oppose
  1. Oppose removal. "A couple of landmarks" is rather an understatement...a basilica that's the burial site of French kings? The national stadium that also hosted the 2024 Olympics? Furthermore, removing Saint-Denis would leave the Ile-de-France, pop 10 million, with just two VA5 entries, including none from the Petite Couronne (pop 4.5 million). pbp 23:34, 20 October 2024 (UTC)
    That's more of an argument for listing Basilica of Saint-Denis, which isn't currently VA, rather than the district its located in (in retrospect that may have been a better swap proposal, but I still think Trier should be listed). Also Ile-de-France is essentially just the Paris metro area, and for comparison, only two areas of London are currently listed (City of London  5, City of Westminster  5). In general the threshold for suburbs and districts is high and in this case listing the landmarks instead makes more sense. Iostn (talk) 22:27, 21 October 2024 (UTC)
Discuss
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Add History of archaeology  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Kevinishere15 (talk) 18:34, 12 December 2024 (UTC)

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We list the History of every other Level 3 discipline, so it's reasonable to have this one as well.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 23:26, 23 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Fair enough reason. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:01, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Makes sense. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 02:19, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makes sense to me. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:55, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add May Fourth Movement  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 09:54, 28 December 2024 (UTC)

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A major event in modern Chinese history with major implications such as the founding of the Chinese Communist Party  4.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 09:54, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Easy support. The Blue Rider 19:34, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 22:21, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add 2000 United States Presidential election

FAILED
Not added 2-4. Makkool (talk) 10:22, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

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Bush v Gore a highly contentious election that set the stage for 21st century American politics. 45 interwikis and over half a million page views in the past 30 days. If added I would suggest History > contemporary > United States, it would be the first election added

Support
  1. @Kevinishere15: Putting my money where my mouth is Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 02:36, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. I think we should list elections, and this should definitely be one of the ones we include. Kevinishere15 (talk) 05:00, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. We could really make the case for tons of important US presidential elections that we don't really have space for, and I don't think this really stands out too strongly other than the disputed outcome, it would make more sense to list elections included with the rise of different Party Systems, if anything. Iostn (talk) 20:10, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. (I may change my vote or rationale pending how the 2024 election develops) Similar to LostN. I don't think this one is a whole helluvalot more important than perhaps a dozen others, for one reason or another. 2020 provoked January 6th. 2008 (and possibly 2024) elected somebody historic. 1932 ushered in the New Deal. 1876 was also hotly contested and litigated (at least figuratively, if not literally). 1860 (listed below) ushered in the American Civil War. 1796 was the first under the two-party system. 1800 was the first peaceful transfer. Also, FWIW, G.W. Bush is Lv4, Gore, Cheney and the Clinton are Lv5. pbp 21:00, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. oppose because I don't really think this one is that important in a long term perspective. I think that there are thousands of changes in administration in governments around the world throughout history that are likely more impactful then this. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:34, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Oppose, would maybe support adding Bush v. Gore or 2000 United States presidential election in Florida. The Blue Rider 21:57, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
    What would make the election in Flordia any more vital then the election overall? Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 22:02, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
Neutral
Comments
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Add Sha Tin District

FAILED
Not added 1-3. Makkool (talk) 10:20, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

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The largest district of Hong Kong  3 by population, larger than many cities we list.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 03:05, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose. I don't think Population alone makes an area vital, and if we start adding specific articles for districts and neighborhoods within cities, this list will get enormous.GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:51, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per PBP. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 22:51, 29 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Adding individual districts is a bridge too far, at least on this level, maybe on V6? Kevinishere15 (talk) 19:49, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
Discuss

What makes, for example, Jersey City, New Jersey  5 any more of a city than Sha Tin, other than Jersey City being legally recognised as a city? feminist🩸 (talk) 03:05, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

What makes it more of a CITY, or what makes it more VITAL?
Because Sha Tin is a district of Hong Kong, you would expect overlap between the two articles. Because Jersey City is an independent city, you would NOT expect it to overlap with NYC or Newark.
And if we're doing rhetoricals, what makes Sha Tin more vital than Ansan, Korea, which is about the same size and is up for removal? What makes it AS vital as Brooklyn or Queens, which have considerably more people? pbp 14:13, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
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Add East Jerusalem

PASSED
Added 5–1. Makkool (talk) 10:03, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

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Important geopolitical concept. pbp 17:16, 14 October 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 17:16, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. If we list East Berlin  5, we should also list East Jerusalem. feminist🩸 (talk) 00:43, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 22:22, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
  5. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 03:10, 19 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose. I'll be the dissenting opinion here. While I know East Jerusalem has some broad significance, I don't think subregions and districts within cities need to be included. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:53, 28 October 2024 (UTC)
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Add Brașov  5

PASSED
Swapped 4–0 with Târgu Mureș. Makkool (talk) 17:07, 2 January 2025 (UTC)

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Brașov has a metropolitan area population of around 350k, making it the fifth-largest city in Romania, and in the same boat as the other Romanian cities on the list, excluding Bucharest  4 and Târgu Mureș. I would propose a swap with the latter, but I'd weakly oppose the removal since we're 25 under quota in Cities. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 21:26, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nom. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 21:26, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support swap with Târgu Mureș Makkool (talk) 15:01, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support swap with Târgu Mureș Interstellarity (talk) 00:46, 27 June 2024 (UTC)
  4. This needs some votes after 8+ months. It seems more vital than Târgu Mureș, so I support an add and am neutral about a swap.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:52, 25 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
    @Makkool: I understand if I am overestimating Romania's importance, but what is your rationale? Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 15:18, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
    I think 8 cities for Romania is just about enough. I would actually support a swap with Târgu Mureș, but not a straight-up add. Makkool (talk) 19:13, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
    I just thought we could have another Romanian city since it is the most populous country in the Balkans  4 (a region that may warrant V3). Mures gets its importance from being the largest city in the Hungarian-speaking Székely Land  5, but I'm not sure if having both the region and the city is necessary.
    Demographically speaking, Mureș has a much weaker case. The largest FUAs in Romania are Bucharest  4 (2.221m), Iași  5 (395k), Cluj-Napoca  5 (386k), Timișoara  5 (352k), Brașov  5 (348k), Constanța  5 (346k), Craiova  5 (264k), Ploiești (248k), Galați  5 (244k), and Oradea (201k). Mureș is a long way down, at 156k. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 21:18, 25 June 2024 (UTC)
    Bulgaria, Hungary and the Czech Republic have 4 cities each, and their population is about half of Romania's, so that's the reasoning for 8 cities. I've changed my stance now from oppose to swap. Makkool (talk) 15:01, 26 June 2024 (UTC)
    Hmm, Bulgaria has five cities (Sofia at V4, Plovdiv, Varna, Burgas, and Ruse) and a population of under 7 million. Are the five of them really all important enough for V5? Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:34, 29 June 2024 (UTC)
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Add 180th meridian  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 16:40, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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Similar in importance to international date line and prime meridian. Interstellarity (talk) 21:33, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. Interstellarity (talk) 21:33, 12 May 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:50, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Supporting so that this can close with 4 supports.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:48, 25 December 2024 (UTC)
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Historical region additions (set 1 of 2)

Since we have cut back the number of regions quite a deal, we could add a few more historical regions.

Add Karelia  5

PASSED
Added 5-0. Makkool (talk) 17:50, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

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Historical region in areas of modern day Finland and Russia. We only list the Russian side, Republic of Karelia  5.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 19:31, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Total population adds up to almost a million. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:23, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. 70 interwikis, rated Top-Importance by WikiProject Russia, WikiProject Finland, and WikiProject Geography. Those are the best stats I have seen for an addition proposal in a while! It also appears to be a vital area according to the article's lead. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:29, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. pbp 14:05, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  5. Surprised we didn't have this already, good find. Aurangzebra (talk) 19:57, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
  1. Would Ingria  5 also be a reasonable addition? Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:16, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  1. Yeah, I didn't think of that. Added a proposal below, thanks! Makkool (talk) 21:36, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
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Add Livonia  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:50, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

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Historical region in areas of modern day Estonia and Latvia.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 19:31, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 22:23, 12 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Seems to have a lot of historical importance. QuicoleJR (talk) 13:30, 15 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 19:57, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Tyrol  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 18:24, 20 September 2024 (UTC)

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We list the Austrian side Tyrol (state)  5 and the Italian side South Tyrol  5, but not the whole historical region itself.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 10:30, 21 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 20:10, 22 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Politically and historical important region. The Blue Rider 00:46, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 02:50, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
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Add Big History

FAILED
Not added, 1-2 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Purplebackpack89 (talk • contribs) 12:51, December 19, 2024 (UTC)

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Important discipline that covers all of history.

Support
  1. Interstellarity (talk) 22:58, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Big History isn't a particulary important academic field, despite its scope. The Blue Rider 23:24, 1 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per TBR Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 02:39, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
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Election additions

wrt to discourse around elections, and since I have also noticed none are listed during the past

This is rather ironic considering there's LITERALLY an AMERICAN election going on TODAY pbp 20:55, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Add 1860 United States presidential election

FAILED
Not added 4–3. Makkool (talk) 16:43, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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Directly setting the stage for the American Civil War  4, it arguably counts as the most important single US election.

Support
  1. As nom Iostn (talk) 20:16, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 20:21, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Eh, if we're gonna start listing U.S. elections, this should be the first one. λ NegativeMP1 22:25, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Makes sense. Kevinishere15 (talk) 22:53, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose because with very few exceptions, I don't think we should start listing elections. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 22:31, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:18, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. We have too many articles about the American Civil War. Would support swapping for a battle. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:18, 8 December 2024 (UTC)
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Add March 1933 German federal election

PASSED
Added 6–0. Makkool (talk) 16:43, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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Led directly to the Nazi seizure of power and indirectly/more arguably, to World War II  3.

Support
  1. As nom Iostn (talk) 20:16, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 20:21, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. I was actually going to nominate this and the one below. Kevinishere15 (talk) 22:53, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Weak support, this is a very rare exception to my opinion on elections being listed. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 22:31, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:18, 8 December 2024 (UTC)
  6. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 04:34, 8 December 2024 (UTC)
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Add 1994 South African general election

PASSED
Added 4–1. Makkool (talk) 16:43, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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Marked the end of Apartheid  4, and more broadly the final end of white minority rule on the African continent.

Support
  1. As nom Iostn (talk) 20:16, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Questions? four Olifanofmrtennant (she/her) 20:21, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Kevinishere15 (talk) 22:55, 5 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 04:34, 8 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose because with very few exceptions, I don't think we should start listing elections. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 22:31, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
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Add Deportation of the Chechens and Ingush  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 16:50, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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A Soviet-era genocide, the most lethal of the genocides that fall under Population transfer in the Soviet Union  4. 200,000 people died, 400,000 according to some sources. 32 interwikis.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:07, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:18, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom Bogazicili (talk) 11:50, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 23:47, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Remove Balibo Five

PASSED
Removed 4–0. Makkool (talk) 16:50, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

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I don’t understand how the killing of five journalists can be same vital level with the East Timor genocide, which killed an estimated 200,000 people.

Support
  1. As nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 14:44, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:03, 4 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 22:46, 11 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:36, 14 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss

Hoben7599 (talk) 14:44, 24 November 2024 (UTC)

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Recent additions without discussion

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I have recently reverted several edits adding entries without discussion by a certain user, mainly to history, which possibly got a lot closer to hitting/exceeding the quota solely based on their additions. I realized I had already reverted these at least twice before, which went seemingly unnoticed and I just had to leave a talk page telling them to stop. Aside from that, I'm not sure how other entries they added should be dealt with, especially as it seems one of them was 8888 Uprising  5 which had an active proposal for when it was added and it was closed seemingly without being noticed. Iostn (talk) 19:11, 31 May 2024 (UTC)

We should probably undo all of their changes that haven't been passed. It seems like we can keep the 8888 Uprising  5 since it passed regardless but everything else should be rolled back. I am going to assume that maybe they were operating in good faith and didn't realize changes required a discussion so hopefully there will be no more after your warning. I can roll some of them back later today. Aurangzebra (talk) 17:03, 1 June 2024 (UTC)
I am removing even more of these that haven't been removed yet. Hoben7599 Varoart2005 and Zanahary - you need to achieve consensus for additions, not just add them yourself undiscussed. starship.paint (RUN) 07:46, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
Apologies @Starship.paint! I was under the impression that level 5 VAs could just be designated boldly. Looking again at the policies, I don’t know where I got that idea. I will initiate a discussion, thank you! ꧁Zanahary꧂ 19:08, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
@Zanahary: - previously it was okay to do so when the lists were far from full, but as we approached quotas then we stopped that practice already. No worries. starship.paint (RUN) 01:56, 2 September 2024 (UTC)
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Add Jewish exodus from the Muslim world  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 01:46, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

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Important concept relating to the Arab–Israeli conflict  4.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:30, 11 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. ꧁Zanahary꧂ 19:13, 1 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:50, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
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South Asian early modern history additions

Add Kingdom of Nagpur  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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One of the four rajas (member states) of the Maratha Confederacy, in addition to Gwalior State  5 and Baroda State  5. Fairly large at its peak.

Support
  1. As nominator. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 14:48, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, the other 2 Maratha states are precedent, and we have the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Indore State  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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One of the four rajas (member states) of the Maratha Confederacy, in addition to Gwalior State  5 and Baroda State  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 14:48, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, the other 2 Maratha states are precedent, and we have the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Ahmadnagar Sultanate  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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Member of the Deccan sultanates  4, and one of the three major of them not already a vital article, in addition to the Sultanate of Bijapur  5 and the Sultanate of Golconda  5. Larger and more prosperous than many of the small states currently in the same category.

Support
  1. As nominator. Flemmish Nietzsche (talk) 14:48, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 15:07, 19 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, the other 2 sultanates are precedent, and we have the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Greater China  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 16:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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A historical-cultural region with ties to the Chinese people, including both People's Republic of China and Republic of China (Taiwan). It feels like an article we should list in Vital Articles: we have the space for it, and it's rated High-Importance in Wikiproject China. Also a decent number of language versions (32).

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 16:17, 25 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Hoben7599 (talk) 06:03, 28 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 14:40, 29 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, and for comparison, we list Anglosphere  5 and Francophonie  5 already, plus South Asia  4 at Lv4. However, we don't yet list Greater Iran  5 or Greater India  5, which are very similar in spirit. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Remove Sungai Ruan and add Perlis  5

PASSED
Swapped 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 01:46, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

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It's a village, not a state or a territory. It's not very noteworthy either. 2 interwikis. Perlis, however, is a state, and it's missing from the list. IDBLWK (talk) 05:27, 3 September 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. IDBLWK (talk) 05:28, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 17:52, 3 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:53, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
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Add Imperial House of Japan  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 01:46, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

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"The Japanese monarchy is the oldest continuous hereditary monarchy in the world." Dates back to at least the 6th century.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:44, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:00, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Northeast megalopolis  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 16:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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World's largest megalopolis by economic output, and USA's most populous megalopolis. Consists of New York, Philadelhia and Boston metropolitan areas combined. The term Megalopolis  5 was popularized by a study published on this region.

New York metropolitan area hasn't been getting support to be added, but I was thinking this larger whole would have better chances.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:23, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. More vital than the Blue Banana 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 21:45, 5 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 14:32, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 16:31, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, gets into some unique regional factors. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add famous beaches

PASSED
Both added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 19:53, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

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Add Bondi Beach  5

World famous beach. To Physical geography

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 14:33, 8 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 22:29, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:02, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion

Add Copacabana, Rio de Janeiro  5

Another, even more famous beach. Although the article is framed to be about a neighbourhood of Rio, rather than the beach. Should be placed to Cities instead then?

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 14:33, 8 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 22:29, 18 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. -TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 23:08, 30 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discussion
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Add Central place theory

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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Central place theory is really important to the discipline of geography, and is fairly old and well established in the literature.

Support
  1. As nom. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:23, 3 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Seems somewhat important, and I believe this section is under the quota. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:35, 4 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support, under Physical geography/Basics Makkool (talk) 10:59, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Definitely, we discussed as part of the wider Geography reorg elsewhere. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss

GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 17:23, 3 November 2024 (UTC)

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Add Ethiopian–Adal War  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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Major war in the region, a proxy war involving several major empires which lasted nearly 14 years. African pre-colonial history is underrepresented, and this war certainly seems important enough to include. Rated High-Importance by WikiProject Somalia and Top-Importance for WikiProject Ethiopia and WikiProject Africa.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 20:12, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:15, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom Bogazicili (talk) 11:50, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Burundian Civil War  5

PASSED
Added 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:22, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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A major war in the region lasting from 1993 to 2005, with a death count of over 300,000. Rated Top-Importance by WikiProject Africa and WikiProject Burundi.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 18:14, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom.--Hoben7599 (talk) 15:09, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 23:47, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Kevinishere15 (talk) 08:12, 28 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Delete List of regions of the United States and List of regions of Japan

PASSED
Removed 5-0, closing a bit early per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 16:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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I went through and searched level five, and these tow articles jump out to me as a bit unnecessary. Both the United States and Japan are well represented in level 5, and many/most/all of the regions in these articles are included. I don't think it is necessary to have a list article of regions included on a list that more or less includes these regions.

Support
  1. As nom GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:55, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 16:34, 16 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:32, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. per nom--Hoben7599 (talk) 06:01, 28 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Sure, while not prohibited, we've usually discouraged list articles. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss

GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:55, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

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Remove Wall Street

FAILED
Not removed 1-4, closing a bit early per WP:SNOW. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 16:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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We don't need many streets at this list. We could probably do without this article. Maybe swap in Midtown Manhattan.

Support
  1. Interstellarity (talk) 19:26, 26 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. It is far more than just a street, as Wall Street is basically synonymous with the stock market, and by extension, the backbone of the entire United States economy. The articles lead section even goes as far as to describe it as the "world's principal fintech and financial center". And yeah, that's pretty much what it is. And swapping with Midtown Manhattan makes zero sense because Wall Street isn't even in Midtown Manhattan. λ NegativeMP1 19:39, 26 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. --LaukkuTheGreit (Talk•Contribs) 20:13, 26 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:13, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per above. Kevinishere15 (talk) 08:11, 28 December 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Staten Island

FAILED
Not removed 2-5, closing a bit early per WP:SNOW. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 16:59, 7 January 2025 (UTC)

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Staten Island is the least populous borough. It doesn't have the same level of importance as the other boroughs like Manhattan, Brooklyn, or Queens have. I would also weekly support remove The Bronx although I'm willing to be convinced into keeping it on the list.

Support
  1. Interstellarity (talk) 19:44, 26 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. We should not be listing individual boroughs in New York City. Population is not the only thing that would make a city vital, but I would likely support the removal of most cities with under half a million people. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 03:34, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose. Staten Island has a population around 500k which is more than many of the cities we list at VA5. It also has a distinct and notable culture (Italian Americans, the Mafia etc.) that isn't sufficiently covered by just the New York City  3 article. Even within the NYC metro area, I would rather get rid of Jersey City first: population is only 300k and no discernible cultural or historical identity to speak of (has a few corporate offices but is mainly just a bedroom community for Manhattan workers) and not I'm not particularly in a rush to do that either. Aurangzebra (talk) 01:29, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. Oppose: It IS smaller than the other four boroughs...but the other four boroughs are all a million plus. It's still twice the size of many of the. It's the most geographically isolated and politically distinct compared to the other four too pbp 21:00, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  3. I think the last year has seen heavyhanded removal of various settlements. We use to protect all capitals and all population leaders. This is an assessment if we want all NYC boroughs. I have trouble convincing myself that this borough is more important than a some state capitals and population leaders (that we delisted), but I prefer all boroughs be kept.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:56, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Per Aurang. Kevinishere15 (talk) 08:11, 28 December 2024 (UTC)
  5. Per TonyTheTiger. Staten Island is more important than some state capitals we list. feminist🩸 (talk) 14:15, 4 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Kolkhoz  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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Collective farming  4 is LV4 so we could have a subtopic for it. The kolkhoz was the collective farm on the Soviet Union. A vital topic for Eastern bloc history.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 17:17, 28 August 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:53, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Battle of the Hydaspes  5 and Battle of Ain Jalut  5

PASSED
Both added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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Two decisive battles in the History of Asia. The former marked Greek expansion into the Indian subcontinent, (such as the Indo-Greek Kingdom  4). The former halted Mongol invasions and conquests  4 into the Middle East and preserved the political and cultural landscape of the region.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 02:40, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom. starship.paint (RUN) 03:15, 15 September 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:54, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Battle of Tsushima  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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The culminating engagement of the Russo-Japanese War  4. Often viewed as one the most important naval battles in history.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 12:26, 30 September 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, history has the room, and important to understanding the build-up to the Russian Revolution. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Peace of Utrecht  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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We list five battles from the War of the Spanish Succession  4 but this is arguably more important. Its provisions drew the balance of power in Europe for much of the 18th century.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 16:55, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, history has the room. Good to include some diplomacy and not just battles too. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Battle of Mohács  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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There were many key battles fought during this period, such as Siege of Vienna (1529) and the Siege of Rhodes (1522). This was arguably the most significant victory by Suleiman the Magnificent  3, marking the expansion of Ottoman influence deeper into Europe, and their coming into direct conflict with the Habsburgs.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 16:55, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Nature reserve  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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Vital omission, should definitely be added. To Physical geography / Parks, preserves and World Heritage Sites.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:36, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 17:09, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, why not? -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Reorganization of Geography section discussion

NOTED
With similar discussions ongoing in other sections, not seeing as much participation in this one. No noticeable opposition to reorganizing Geography at VA5 so far though, and replies seem positive about a change. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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This might take some work in other sections but starting here. Cartography is currently listed under the physical geography section, which is odd. Human geography also makes extensive use of cartography, and it seems it was thrown in there because we didn't know where to put it. We should try to create an organizational hierarchy that mirrors how geography is organized in literature. There are a few options, and you can read more on the Geography page. The two I'd recommend are the Four traditions of geography (a page I created, full disclosure), or the branch model of human geography, physical geography, and technical geography. Under the branch model, cartography is under technical geography. Under the four traditions, it would likely fit in the "spatial tradition." I would ideally want to use the branch model, but will create a discussion here about how to proceed with this broad reorganization.

Discuss

GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 07:15, 11 November 2024 (UTC)

I think Geography/Basics was added under Physical geography simply, because it was too small to be exist on its own. We can re-organize surely, if a better structure would be worth the effort. Have you considered making a proposition for a more detailed plan? Makkool (talk) 18:23, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
I can see why that decision could be made, but oppose it on the grounds of it not reflecting the way outside literature organizes the discipline. The geography page has three main lists for the branches, and we could put the general/technical stuff into a category based on this organization. The current layout is gives a lot of undue weight to physical geography, when human geography makes just as much use of these tools/techniques. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 19:05, 20 November 2024 (UTC)
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Add Yellow Turban Rebellion  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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Sometimes viewed as the single largest peasant revolt in antiquity. It contributed significantly to the fall of the Han Dynasty, leading to the Three Kingdoms period.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 20:30, 17 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. ibid. --Hoben7599 (talk) 14:46, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 23:47, 24 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. Surprised this isn't already listed. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Great Fire of Rome  5

PASSED
Added 5-0 per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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One of the most devastating fires in history. Led to the destruction of two-thirds of Rome, and to an increased persecution of Christians throughout the Roman Empire.

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 19:54, 27 December 2024 (UTC)
  2. pbp 01:16, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
  3. Sure, history has the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
  4. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 16:40, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
  5. Per above. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 01:24, 12 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add 2023 Turkey–Syria earthquakes

PASSED
Added 6-0 per WP:AVALANCHE. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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From an above discussion, @Dora the Axe-plorer suggested "its significance historically and within the geoscience community." Feel free to add more context in your vote or the Discussion section.

I should elaborate further: Regionally significant disaster in Turkey and Syria; massive scale of destruction and the deadliest in both countries in centuries. Nearly 60,000 killed in both countries and met with a global response from dozens of nations aiding in rescue and recovery. Areas affected by these shocks are still and the long-term effects are quite obvious, for example in Antakya, only 250 thousand residents remain, while the pre-disaster population was 1.7 million.
Also a very significant event in the geoscience community; at least 380 peer-reviewed articles published in journals for the first earthquake. The two earthquakes are among the most studied within the community.Dora the Axe-plorer (explore) 03:30, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

Presumably would go in History -> Contemporary -> West Asia.

Support
  1. Nomination for Dora the Axe-plorer. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 03:13, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
  2. I was thinking about this being an example of recentism, but the number of disasters we have listed with fewer deaths and less damage makes me think this is fine to include. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 03:31, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
  3. The statistics speak for themselves. --ZergTwo (talk) 03:45, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
  4. For V5 at least, I don't think recentism should be a concern when comes to wars and natural disasters that results in these many human lives being lost. λ NegativeMP1 03:53, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
  5. Deadliest earthquake since Haiti. Top-importance in WP:EARTHQUAKE. Extremely large effect. -- Wildfireupdateman (Wildfireupdateman)
  6. Weak support, a bit recent but still clearly a major disaster with continuing effects. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:32, 12 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss

Zar2gar1 (talk) 03:13, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

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Historical cities additions

Add Olympia, Greece  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 17:19, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

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The location of the ancient Olympic games. Add to historical cities.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 13:23, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 08:12, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Why not. JpTheNotSoSuperior (talk) 03:05, 10 August 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add Smyrna  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 19:34, 12 January 2025 (UTC)

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An ancient Greek city in Anatolia, now Izmir, Türkiye.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:28, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 08:12, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Vileplume 🍋‍🟩 (talk) 11:58, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. We already list İzmir  4, but some overlap is good at Lv5, and we should have the room. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:01, 2 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add Lüshunkou, Dalian  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 20:55, 14 January 2025 (UTC)

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Formerly the historical city of Port Arthur, now a part of larger city Dalian  4.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 18:28, 27 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 00:40, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  3. Iostn (talk) 08:12, 28 July 2024 (UTC)
  4. Yeah, Port Arthur is a pretty historical and geographically important place. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 18:44, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Neutral
Discuss
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Add German atrocities committed against Soviet prisoners of war  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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Not the snappiest title, but these were responsible for around 3 million deaths. From the article: “The deaths among Soviet prisoners of war were numerically exceeded only by the (civilian) Jews and has been called "one of the greatest crimes in military history".

Support
  1. As nominator. Tabu Makiadi (talk) 03:30, 11 July 2024 (UTC)
  2. Iostn (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:51, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, after some thought, we're still filling in the section. We can worry about over-representation of WWII later. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
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Add World Heritage Sites

The physical geography section has some room, and so I thought some missing World Heritage Sites could be added.

Add Dolomites  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 12:24, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

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Well-known mountain range in Italy. There's a national park and several other regional parks.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:12, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom, surprised we don't list these already. Aurangzebra (talk) 21:50, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. pbp 21:23, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:00, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Plitvice Lakes National Park  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 19:58, 8 January 2025 (UTC)

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Popular national park in Croatia, and the most famous natural wonder of the country.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:12, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:51, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:00, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Komodo National Park  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. Makkool (talk) 12:24, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

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National park in Indonesia, established to protect the habitat of the endagered Komodo dragon.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:12, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:51, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nominator. The Blue Rider 19:36, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:00, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Wadi Rum  5

PASSED
Added 4–0. Makkool (talk) 20:55, 14 January 2025 (UTC)

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Archaelogically important valley in Jordan, also one their most known tourist attractions.

Support
  1. As nom. Makkool (talk) 21:12, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. per nom Aurangzebra (talk) 21:51, 12 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:01, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Sure, don't see why we wouldn't add this with the other ones. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 18:44, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Discuss
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Add Nevado Sajama  5

PASSED
Added 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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The highest peak in Bolivia, an extinct volcano with a decent amount of geographical and cultural importance. 44 interwikis, rated High-Importance by WikiProject Volcanoes and Top-Importance by WikiProject Mountains.

Support
  1. As nom. QuicoleJR (talk) 19:06, 2 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Makkool (talk) 21:24, 4 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Definitely, especially since we're still under quota in Phys Geo. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 18:44, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
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Remove Gelsenkirchen and Oberhausen

PASSED
Both removed, Gelsenkirchen at 4-1, Oberhausen at 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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We list six cities in the Ruhr, a relatively dense urban area. I do not see the need to list this many. Oberhausen in particular is overshadowed by the nearby larger cities of Duisburg  5 and Essen  5.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 15:46, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. This and the addition of Rhineland, which might be close to V4. 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 17:24, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Weak support, largely just to close this one out, but we're close to quota on cities and I get the feeling we'll be cutting them at some point in the future. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Oppose Gelsenkirchen due to its important historial industrial status ("In the early 20th century, Gelsenkirchen was the most important coalmining town in Europe"), neutral on Oberhausen as that does have a 200k+ population and it may be a case of the article being in a poor status and not really explaining its full significance. Iostn (talk) 22:05, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
    Also to add: Germany is actually underrepresnted relative to other European countries, with a population of 82 million, but with the same number of cities as France (~66 million in metropole) and less than the UK (~68 million) Iostn (talk) 22:09, 15 October 2024 (UTC)
    I proposed Weimar above to compensate for Germany's underrepresentation 🍋‍🟩 OhnoitsvileplumeXD (talk) 01:55, 23 October 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Wolverhampton

PASSED
Removed 4-1. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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Overshadowed by the much larger city of Birmingham  4 nearby within the West Midlands conurbation.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 15:48, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Interstellarity (talk) 21:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
  4. Weak support, largely just to close this one out, but we're close to quota on cities and I get the feeling we'll be cutting them at some point in the future. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Since Birmingham is V4, it makes sense to have a city in the metro area at this level. Kevinishere15 (talk) 19:53, 13 October 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Zhongxing New Village

PASSED
Removed 4-0. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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A small planned town whose only claim to fame is serving as the seat of the nominal Taiwan Provincial Government from 1957 to 2018.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 09:13, 14 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 14:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
  3. Support, but very weak. This seems like it might be a pretty big claim to fame. That said, tehre are many other things that should be included this removal could make room for. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:38, 31 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Weak support, largely just to close this one out, but we're close to quota on cities and I get the feeling we'll be cutting them at some point in the future. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
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Remove Ansan, Anyang, Gyeonggi, Gwangmyeong and Uijeongbu

PASSED
All removed, Gwangmyeong at 5-0, all others at 4-1. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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Suburbs of Seoul  4 which are not particularly large.

Support
  1. As nominator. feminist🩸 (talk) 08:44, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Support removal of all per nom. Makkool (talk) 16:55, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
  3. Support all removal — Preceding unsigned comment added by OlifanofmrTennant (talk • contribs) 22:54, 29 October 2024 (UTC)
  4. Weak support, largely just to close this one out, but we're close to quota on cities and I get the feeling we'll be cutting them at some point in the future. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Mixed
  • Support Gwangmyeong only, oppose the rest: Two of these have populations over half a mil and a third is over 400,000. See below pbp 12:29, 24 October 2024 (UTC)
Discuss

FWIW, here are the populations of the four cities in question:

  • Ansan 623,256
  • Anyang 551,228
  • Gwangmyeong 277,564
  • Uijeongbu 460,284

Makes you wonder how large is "not particularly large" pbp 12:29, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

The majority of the districts of Seoul each have a population of over 400,000, but we do not list any districts of Seoul at level 5. There is more to city vitality than population alone. feminist🩸 (talk) 02:53, 25 October 2024 (UTC)
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Remove Stirling

PASSED
Removed 4-0 (but still: long live tha Puggy!) -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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This "city" has under 50,000 people. At one time, we thought Scotland was underrepresented, but with 6 cities against only 5 million people, it's probably OVERrepresented now pbp 15:47, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. pbp 15:47, 30 October 2024 (UTC)
  2. Per nom. Makkool (talk) 13:10, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. To steelman the argument, this was once the capital of Scotland. However, other than the language connection, there is nothing particular about Scotland justifying us to list more cities per capita than other countries. feminist🩸 (talk) 03:14, 6 January 2025 (UTC)
  4. "Long live tha Puggy!" ... but still weak support, largely just to close this one out. We're close to quota on cities too, and I get the feeling we'll be cutting them at some point in the future. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 02:47, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
Discussion
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Add Gaza genocide as a Level 5 Vital article

FAILED
Not added 2-5, with most opposition focused on recency. However, nom mentioned Persecution of Uyghurs in China  5 for comparison; consider reviewing other recent, politically charged topics in History for removal in light of this proposal. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 17:42, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

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Should Gaza genocide be added as a Level 5 Wikipedia:Vital article? This was originally a topic here, but I am changing it to a RfC to get more community input Bogazicili (talk) 16:32, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

Support
  1. As nominator. At a minimum, it is similar to Persecution of Uyghurs in China  5. Israeli–Palestinian conflict  4 is a higher level. Level 5 seems appropriate. Bogazicili (talk) 18:16, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. So I don't expect this to pass at this point, and I usually try to avoid very intense topics. But trying to stay objective, OP does have a couple of points, mainly this being an exception to recentism. First, Israelis & Gazans have fought several wars before, but this time is qualitatively different, with clear effects already around the world. Second, if we're going to argue it's too recent, we probably should delist Persecution of Uyghurs in China  5. I really don't want to touch the third rail (politics) of Wikipedia around topics like that, but I don't see how we can honestly keep the one and omit the other. -- Zar2gar1 (talk) 18:44, 7 January 2025 (UTC)
Oppose
  1. Israel–Hamas war is a level 5 vital, no need for sub-sub-topics; if anything 7 October Hamas-led attack on Israel seems more appropriate, as it is more similar to September 11 attacks  4 and the subsequent US invasions. The Blue Rider 18:33, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
    @The Blue Rider: I wouldn't consider Gaza genocide a child article of Israel–Hamas war. They have overlapping material, but Gaza genocide has a different scope, including events that are happening outside the conflict area such as ongoing genocide investigation.
    World War I is not the child article of Assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand.
    I'm ok with 7 October Hamas-led attack on Israel being level 5. Bogazicili (talk) 15:31, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
  2. Weak oppose - As it stands, this is largely synonymous with the article on the war. I think before this can be listed separately, we'd have to look at its impact on Gazan/Palestinian society once the death has stopped, in order to distinguish it from the article on the war, which we obviously won't be able to do for some time. Iostn (talk) 20:08, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
    @Iostn: see above Bogazicili (talk) 15:31, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
  3. Oppose for at least several years. I get the desire to include every item currently in the news in these lists, but we need a bit of distance/hindsight before we can determine how vital it actually is. Like, if this was 1995 we might think NATO bombing of Yugoslavia, Operation Deliberate Force, or Operation Deny Flight should be included, but with the benefit of almost 30 years it's fairly safe to leave them off the list. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 02:00, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
    @GeogSage: did any of them result in genocide investigation against those NATO countries? And no, I have no desire to include every item currently in the news in these lists Bogazicili (talk) 15:33, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
    @Bogazicili: they were in response to humanitarian issues like the Račak massacre, and all the other specific War crimes in the Kosovo War. The entire Kosovo War  5 is level 5, we don't need to include every incident and set of war crimes. Yes, there was ethnic cleansing involved. We also don't list the the Buryat genocide, Massacres of Albanians in the Balkan Wars, the Anfal campaign, the Late Ottoman genocides, Pontic Greek genocide, the Hamidian massacres, or other notable topics. Including the entire list of horrible things humans have done would need it's own list. I would personally want to let the dust settle for a few years on a developing WP:contentious topics topic like this. For example, and more to the point, we don't include First Battle of Gaza, Second Battle of Gaza, or Third Battle of Gaza, we just include the Sinai and Palestine campaign  5. Currently, the Israeli invasion of the Gaza Strip isn't included as a vital article, nor is the 7 October Hamas-led attack on Israel, and I would consider it early to include either as it's hard to know how significant it will be in the broader context of the Israel–Hamas war. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 19:15, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
    @GeogSage:
    The article Late Ottoman genocides would be like the article Native American genocide in the United States. Both of them are not listed as vital articles. But the following articles are listed: Armenian genocide  4, California genocide  5, Greek genocide  5, Sayfo  5, Trail of Tears  5.
    But after checking few things, I did see a discrepancy. For example: Persecution of Muslims during the Ottoman contraction  5 and Pacification of Algeria.
    I guess this would be due to Wikipedia:Systemic bias.
    This is also the conclusion of a PhD thesis:

    It demonstrates that Wikipedia narratives about national histories are distributed unevenly across the continents, with significant focus on the history of European countries (Eurocentric bias)

    Going back to Gaza genocide. Your initial analogy does not make sense to me. Countries participating in NATO bombings were not accused of genocide. See: South Africa's genocide case against Israel. So the analogy does not make sense in terms of what the attackers are accused of. Israel is the attacker in Gaza.
    The loss of human life in in Gaza genocide could be up to 335,500 [1]. This is multiple orders of magnitude higher than loss of life in your examples: NATO bombing of Yugoslavia, Operation Deliberate Force, or Operation Deny Flight. So the scale in your examples is not comparable to Gaza genocide. Bogazicili (talk) 16:23, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
    The lists here are not going to be perfect, and there are several pages that are not currently included like the example I gave of the Pontic Greek genocide which had "approximately 350,000 deaths", and ones you have mentioned. You stated "The loss of human life in in Gaza genocide could be up to 335,500." This is my main problem, the dust has not settled on these current events, and we don't know how things will turn out, and have a very limited idea about what has actually happened there. There are many similar events in history that we have a clearer picture of that are not included, and I'm concerned the introduction of this topic is Recency bias and is more current events then history at this moment. People haven't introduced a lot of these historic genocides because they have faded from public memory and are lost in the sea of tragedies that are in history. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 19:10, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
    @GeogSage: And I am concerned about Wikipedia:Systemic bias.
    I've quoted you research about the Eurocentric bias in English-language Wikipedia.
    Do you have any research about Recency bias in English-language Wikipedia? Bogazicili (talk) 19:16, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
    Analysing Timelines of National Histories Across Wikipedia Editions: A Comparative Computational Approach discusses recency bias. You're concerned about bias on Wikipedia, which I get, but it definitely seems like you're not particularly neutral in the things you have proposed adding. Please remember that Wikipedia is not a soapbox or means of promotion Advocacy, propaganda, or recruitment of any kind: commercial, political, scientific, religious, national, sports-related, or otherwise. An article can report objectively about such things, as long as an attempt is made to describe the topic from a neutral point of view. You might wish to start a blog or visit a forum if you want to convince people of the merits of your opinion, and Wikipedia is not a place to hold grudges or import personal conflicts, nor is it the place to carry on ideological battles or nurture prejudice, hatred, or fear.
    The articles you're nominating, the examples I've listed you ignored, the Wikiprojects you list on your userpage, Wikipedia:Gaming the system on RfC, and hostility here makes it seem to me like you have a possible political agenda. The dust hasn't settled on this ongoing situation, my opinion on this nomination won't change for at least a few years. GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 21:40, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
    @GeogSage: please refrain from WP:Aspersions. Thanks. Bogazicili (talk) 22:04, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
    k GeogSage (⚔Chat?⚔) 22:46, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  4. I understand why you would think this article should be vital, I really do, and I'd almost certainly be open to it in the future. But I think that listing it at present is more or less political advocacy, as it's almost impossible to realistically separate this from the war (which is already vital), and that is not what Wikipedia stands for. I don't think it's comparable to something like Persecution of Uyghurs in China  5 or Holocaust. I really hope this does not sound apathetic, but we really do need at least few years to determine whether or not this needs to be listed separately from the more broad Israel–Hamas war depending on how the war develops (which, with recent geopolitical developments, is definitely possible and is why I am open to adding it in the future). Also, I agree with below comments regarding that this shouldn't have been made into an RfC. λ NegativeMP1 22:00, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
  5. Weak oppose. I'm sympathetic to the reasons you have nominated this, but it seems a little too recent to assess vitality. I would be open to having this discussion again a few years down the line, after the war ends. QuicoleJR (talk) 17:45, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
Discuss

Note that I started this topic on November 8. But turned it into an RfC now to get more community input. Looking at previous topics on this page, there seems to be usually 3 or 4 !votes. Bogazicili (talk) 16:35, 10 November 2024 (UTC)

Seems like you are not liking the current outcome of your proposal and turned it into a RfC. Do take in mind that the WP:VA does have de facto guidelines on what to add. If you want more people to participate I would encourage you to give them some direction on said guidelines. The Blue Rider 19:24, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
Per Wikipedia talk:Requests for comment/Archive 16#Specifying that RfCs should not be listed on AfDs, the same rational applies here. RfC for meta proposals that will affect the Wikipedia as a whole, like the Vital topicon would be appropriate but this is not. I will remove the RfC. The Blue Rider 19:28, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
@The Blue Rider: I don't see it here: Wikipedia:Requests_for_comment#What_not_to_use_the_RfC_process_for. Bogazicili (talk) 19:35, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
That's not an exhaustive list, just the most common places to not RfC. The Blue Rider 19:37, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
I don't think there's consensus that this page can't have RfC's. Bogazicili (talk) 19:39, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
If you disagree then start a discussion on the main WP:VA's talk page. Templating me for "editing" Arab–Israeli conflict is out of line, drop it. The Blue Rider 19:42, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
My understanding of Wikipedia:Contentious topics/Arab–Israeli conflict is that it includes discussions such as this: edits relating to the Arab-Israeli conflict, to pages and discussions in all namespaces with the exception of userspace ("related content") Bogazicili (talk) 19:51, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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