Talk:Syrian Army

Should this article be split?

"Syrian Army" should be just a disambiguation link for all the rival Syrian Armies (Syrian Arab Army, Free Syrian Army, New Syrian Army, Syrian National Army, among others - here I listed only these from just either current time or recent years). 94.254.152.108 (talk) 08:21, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Support They are different things and is in complete restructuring. DerEchteJoan (talk) 00:00, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

The Syrian Arab Army is the official and legitimate army of Syria. Others are just rebel militias supported by foreign powers, therefore it should remainas it is. Martimix (talk) 18:14, 17 January 2023 (UTC)

The SAA is also supported by the foreign powers (and created by a rebellion, by the Baathists), but in any case the problem still is that the article name is just "Syrian Army" instead of the Syrian Arab Army. That is using some kind of an unofficial name instead of this group's official name as the article itself notes in the very first sentence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.254.185.85 (talk) 08:29, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose militants and rebel militias/groups can't be describe as a army of state. If we starts applying this then all countries armies articles will have "disambiguation link". 103.141.159.224 (talk) 10:29, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

I guess you will agree to split now, when the Arab Army is finally no more. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.246.147.217 (talk) 06:21, 8 December 2024 (UTC)

94.246.147.217: No, I just reverted your edits to disagree splitting. Achmad Rachmani (talk) 06:47, 8 December 2024 (UTC)

Why? The previously stated argument "The Syrian Arab Army is the official and legitimate army of Syria. Others are just rebel militias supported by foreign powers, therefore it should remain as it is." is obviously 100% moot now. The free Syria is to create a new army while the Assad regime's SAA supported by foreign powers has been completely disbanded and abolished. Same for the Syrian Arab Armed Forces, Syrian Arab Air Force, Syrian Arab Navy, and so on. These are now only historical organisations that no longer exist, and so they should treated just like the Soviet Army or Imperial Russian Army that ceased to exist along with their regimes. And especially since the likes of the Syrian National Army do still exist today, as does theirs Syrian government Syrian Salvation Government. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.246.147.217 (talk) 20:16, 16 December 2024 (UTC)

Oppose Split - there is a big thread of historical continuity between the Syrian Army of 1946 and all the way up to 2024. Now we have a new and uncertain situation, which means there is only the barest details to reference about the new Syrian Army. When there is more than at least 36kB of readable prose size (see WP:SIZERULE) about the new force, then a split could be considered. Not before. Buckshot06 (talk) 02:13, 26 December 2024 (UTC)

@Achmad Rachmani @Buckshot06 @Martimix The transitional government has appointed new Major and Brigadier Generals, Colonels, and refers to the current army as the Syrian Arab Army. It seems, therefore, that the army is being restructured with former rebel fighters. Source –yeagvr · ✉ 23:38, 30 December 2024 (UTC)

Until today, current islamist rebel militias did not cease to exist (de facto). The Army is not existing, when you appoint some (foreign nationals) or rebel leaders as commanders. It needs clear legal anchoring, structure, organization, etc. I oppose split of articles.... Martimix (talk) 10:05, 31 December 2024 (UTC)

• Oppose Better to keep it as one article, given that the Syrian Army continues to be called the 'Syrian Arab Army' (الجيش العربي السوري‎). The Iraqi Ba'athist army is also apart of the Iraqi Armed Forces, Iraqi Ground Forces, etc pages, rather then being seperate. --Canned Knight (talk) 11:37, 2 January 2025 (UTC)

References

It's a mixed result though, even though Hussein's army wasn't distinguished from the current Iraqi Army (perhaps because Wikipedia wasn't as established in 2003), the Libyan Army (1951–2011) is. And although what you cited appears to be true with regard to the new government still calling their army the "Syrian Arab Army", this will only add confusion for the very distinct and different SAA of the Ba'athist Syria. If we do the article split, we can call it the Syrian Arab Army (1963-2024), because again, Libya's Army under Qaddafi has the same name as the current Libyan Army. However, it is distinguished, because it became a part of the Government of National Accord (GNA - 2015 to 2021) and the Government of National Unity (GNU - 2021 to present). SkoraPobeda (talk) 17:10, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Oppose There is no evidence to suggest that the new government will eliminate all traces of the previous regime. Valorthal77 (talk) 03:25, 4 January 2025 (UTC)

• Support split - There is a clear distinction between the Ba'athist Syrian Arab Army and the current one. We can see that Qaddafi's Libyan Army is distinguished too: Libyan Army (1951–2011) Why? Well the same reason why the Imperial German Army is not the same as the 3rd Reich Heer. Same reason why the Soviet Army is not the same as the post-1991 Russian Ground Forces, etc. The Syrian Arab Army is no longer that; so all of the battles that they were involved with would be confusing to continue having in the post-Assad regime article. Their Civil War was already confusing enough for people who couldn't differentiate between the different rebel factions. So a post-regime new army that is made of these former rebel factions cannot be equated with the Assad regime army that was not the same at all.

Let's especially consider that all previous SAA military units will eventually be removed to avoid confusion of the current Syrian Army military structure, meaning the historical information of the SAA could potentially be lost. On top of that, the Syrian Arab Army emblem and flags are no longer posted here, even though as a significant historical part of their history, it deserves its own representation. Especially since the SAA flag has been used in so many infoboxes of the Syrian Civil War articles.

This split should have been done months ago after the Assad regime fell, since the current Syrian Army are essentially the successors to Tahrir al-Sham, SNA and many dozens of other groups that fought against the SAA. Also important to point out that the Syrian Arab Armed Forces article shows that it is disbanded, same with the Syrian Arab Navy.

I propose that for this article, we condense some of the historical information of the SAA, and the rest of it we merge into a newly created Syrian Arab Army article. Examples of the merge would include Military ranks of Syria (which can be renamed "Military ranks of the Syrian Arab Armed Forces"). List of equipment of the Syrian Army, which I have edited for years, should remain as a historical article (since we distinguish them from the List of military equipment used by Syrian opposition forces), I can rename it to "List of equipment of the Syrian Arab Army"). And very importantly to once again avoid confusion, the Structure of the Syrian Army from 2001 and 2022 Order of Battle can be merged in the new SAA article. While keeping this one with a new 2025 Order of Battle, since there are completely new and different units being created by the new regime.

For example, the Syrian Free Army article states that they have now merged into the new Syrian Army:

• In June 2025, according to The Jerusalem Post, the Syrian Free Army is now part of the new 70th Division of the Syrian army.

With this in mind, there is no mention of any 70th Division here. Meaning the article is outdated all because we are holding in limbo all of the old information from the old army while trying to figure out what to do with the new information. It makes no sense, it is illogical guys, I am trying to do a compromise idea here that everybody can agree on. So please take this into consideration, I myself am willing to do the merging process. SkoraPobeda (talk) 16:49, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

One final point, I just realized that the original split proposal was made in 2023. That was before the immense changes of the past year. It made sense back in 2023 to keep the article as it was. But now, with all of what I mentioned above, it is good reason that we do the split, in order to preserve the historical army and to update the new army. Very simple. SkoraPobeda (talk) 16:54, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Indeed, the excellent table at Syrian Armed Forces, which was 90% about the army, had not been copied over here. I've fixed that. You will now see that the 70th Division is in Damascus under Issam Bouidani. Buckshot06 (talk) 18:18, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Okay that's helpful yes, but the Syrian Arab Army of 1963-2024 timeline would be very helpful as a standalone article to avoid confusion or taking away the history from it. Aside from the 70th Division point, you have to take into consideration that this new Syrian Arab Army is not the same at all as the one from pre-2024. It is a successor to the many different rebel groups. SkoraPobeda (talk) 19:25, 27 July 2025 (UTC)

New promotions list

The new promotions list is visible via https://x.com/azelin/status/1873401988052091047. It lists two major-generals (Murhaf Abu Qasra and the new defence minister); five brigadier-generals; and 42 colonels. 03:05, 2 January 2025 (UTC)

On 29 December 2024, Ahmed al-Sharaa announced the promotion of 42 individuals to the rank of Colonel, 5 to the rank of Brigadier General, and 2 to the rank of Major-General in the Syrian Army. This number included Defense Minister Abu Qasra and new Chief of the General Staff of the Syrian Armed Forces and Army Ali Noureddine Al-Naasan, who were both elevated to the rank of Major-General.

There are a number of foreign-sounding names on the list, including Uygurs. Buckshot06 (talk) 03:16, 2 January 2025 (UTC)

From Twitter: https://x.com/QalaatAlMudiq/status/1874171880619597882:- comment "Jamil Saleh, commander of Jaish Izza, has been promoted to the rank of Brigadier General in the new Syrian Army. Defected #SAA Officer, his group was based in the N. #Hama countryside and never gave up the fight against Assad's Regime despite being uprooted mid-2019." Remember, this is one random guy on the net writing here. Buckshot06 (talk) 03:20, 2 January 2025 (UTC)

References

I agree we should make a new article

I feel like it would be better to make a new article like the same thing of this article but a different one it would be way better so ye Bobjohn500 (talk) 17:57, 25 January 2025 (UTC)

Flag and logo

@Freedoxm, Abo Yemen, RamiPat, SkoraPobeda, and Buckshot06: did you know if a separate flag is used by new Syrian troops? Panam2014 (talk) 22:54, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

If someone could made the flag of the Division 42 of Special Forces. Panam2014 (talk) 23:42, 30 July 2025 (UTC)