Talk:Mohammedan

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Etymology

This page is misleading because it says that European had a mistaken belief about Muslims, and that the term "Christian" is based on the worship of Christ. There is a source about what "some Europeans believed". Okay, I am sure that some Europeans were mistaken, just as I am sure that some Muslims were mistaken about how the English language works. The term "Christian" comes from belief in the teachings of Jesus Christ, and not from worship of Christ. Mohammedan and Christian are analogous to many other terms, such as Lutheran, Buddhist, Confucian, Calvinist, etc. They mean following the teachings, not worship. Some Muslims object to the term Mohammedan anyway, but this objection should not be extended to leave the reader entirely false impressions about what Europeans believed and how English works. I have made a couple of edits to partially correct the article, but they have been reverted. Please address the issues here. Roger (talk) 22:58, 10 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"Some modern Muslims have objected to the term, saying that the term was not used by Muhammad himself or his early followers" Muhammad and his followers spoke Arabic, not English.

"Muslims believe "Mohammedan" is a misnomer, "which seem[s] to them to carry the implication of worship of Mohammed, as Christian and Christianity imply the worship of Christ."" So all the Lutherans I know are worshippers of Martin Luther?

"Also, the term al-Muḥammadīya has been used in Islam to denote several sects considered heretical." al-Muhammadiya is an Arabic word, Mohammedan is an English one. The fact that they sound alike is no more relevant than any other pair of sound alike words in two languages.

All of these "objections" seem like utterly ridiculous attempts to force one language's rules and norms onto another. How has anyone been able to raise these "objections" without having the hearer just laugh in their face?--Khajidha (talk) 15:57, 5 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Other adjectives for Islam

Many adjectives have been used to describe the religion and culture of Islam:

Mohammedan (largely obsolete)
Muslim
Islamic -- sometimes a synonym for Muslim, but used by some scholars for the culture area rather than the religion -- see, for example, Oleg Grabar's Formation of Islamic Art (1973)
Islamicate -- introduced by Marshall Hodgson (1974) to speak of the characteristics of regions where Muslims were culturally dominant
Islamist (starting in 1980) -- "that advocates or supports increasing the influence of Islamic law in politics and society" (OED)

I'm sure I can find plenty of RS to discuss the history, meaning, implications, and significance of the different terms, and I think it would be worthwhile to discuss all that in one place. So I propose to rename this article Adjectives for Islam and discuss them all here. --Macrakis (talk) 16:28, 21 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

We already have articles for Mohammedan, Muslim, Islamic, and Islamist. No need to combine them. Alanscottwalker (talk) 22:23, 21 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Muslim article is about followers of Islam, not about the adjectival use in English. In the Muslim#Etymology section, there is a paragraph comparing the word Muslim to the word Mohammedan / Mahometan / Mussulman, and also mentioning Muslimite and Muslimist. But it does not mention Islamic, Islamicate, and Islamist.

Islamic redirect to Islam; in the section Islam#Culture, there is a brief discussion of "Islamic" and "Islamicate", but not the other terms.

Islamist redirects to Islamism and does not analyze the relationship of that concept with the others mentioned above.

I will write an article synthesizing all this -- with WP:RS of course. I think you'll see that there's a fair amount to say here. --Macrakis (talk) 18:32, 22 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Removed "Usage by Muslims"

The section "Usage by Muslims" strangely conflated terms in other languages, such as Muhammadiyah, with English "Mohammedan". The section had been flagged by another editor as irrelevant. I agree and would add that the section indicated confusion about the scope of the article.

I removed the section. Including it made about as much sense as littering the article about the Society of Jesus with song titles like 800 Pound Jesus. — ℜob C. alias ALAROB 15:52, 18 April 2025 (UTC)[reply]