Talk:McGehee School

Campus map

http://web.archive.org/web/19990224014124im_/http://www.mcgehee.k12.la.us/images/MapCampu.GIF - http://www.webcitation.org/6e4mSkJXg

This is a map of the school campus WhisperToMe (talk) 19:39, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Stop reposting FALSE information!!

Please, allow us to post facts and not this continued rubbish. I will elaborate more later, but this page is continually reposted with false, damaging and flat out incorrect information! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 168.215.186.146 (talk) 16:41, 1 May 2013 (UTC)

• If it's sourced to a reliably-published book, it's not false. Now, history is history. What was true then may not be true today, but we have to fully document the past. WhisperToMe (talk) 06:33, 6 December 2015 (UTC)
• Quote in question uses a present perfect tense and the introductory phrase "For decades" both of which indicate ongoing discrimination. The page is alleging current and ongoing discrimination. This is wildly inflammatory and seems to hold no factual basis. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8807:6803:B500:C9F1:A6D8:3CD8:D440 (talk) 17:15, 20 November 2020 (UTC)
• IP editor, you asked for a third opinion. However, the issue doesn't seem to have been thoroughly discussed so the request isn't exactly following all of the instructions. That being said, the information is relevant here because it is in a reliable source. You say it alleges this in the present tense, but that is only part of the quote. The full passage is In 2005 Eli Evans wrote that "For decades McGehee has been the institution by which the elite in New Orleans shield their young women from the blacks, the Jews, the poor, and the different, protecting them from ideas and associations that might lure them from their manifest destiny.", which is pass tense. It also credits this observation to a person to emphasize this may not be a universally accepted fact. Sam-2727 (talk) 02:36, 22 November 2020 (UTC)

The one major aspect I found is that the book was first published in 1973 (there was a newly printed edition in 2005). So I did err in not checking more into when the book was first written. Having said that, an exact quote needs to be represented exactly or one can replace a few key words in brackets like "McGehee [had]" to emphasize this was past-tense, but that Evans did not write the word "had" directly.

The point of the quote itself, and in covering Evans' statements, is to express how the school was in the past (as in prior to 1973) and not today in 2024. I have no doubt McGehee has changed as an institution. Wikipedia articles are not all about promotion, and need to cover the good, the bad, and the ugly (hence Evans's quotes). However my point is to show that the school may have had a complicated past, but this does not reflect on the school in 2024.

WhisperToMe (talk) 23:32, 14 January 2024 (UTC)

I found a copy on the Wayback Machine. This is the 1997 edition (ISBN 0-684-83412-X). Part V Discrimination Chapter Fifteen New Orleans - the Velvet Rut starts on page 198. Page 209 states: "For decades McGehee has been the institution by which the elite in New Orleans shield their young women from the blacks, the Jews, the poor, and the different, protecting them from ideas and associations that might lure them from their manifest destiny." ... So indeed the phrase is in older editions of the book (yes, older than 2005) and AFAIK this is in the original 1970s printings. So this statement by Eli Evans was made in the 1970s and likely reflects mid-20th century views (think of Gentleman's Agreement from 1947 and Crossfire, also from 1947 ) WhisperToMe (talk) 22:10, 15 July 2025 (UTC)

Requested Edits - August 2025

Hello. I’d like to propose ideas to improve this page to address the warning template at the top of the article. I have a conflict of interest as an employee of the school and was advised by User:Brucemyboy1212 of WhiteHatWiki. I will make suggestions on the Talk page as mandated by COI policy. Thank you.

1. Please replace the third sentence of the first paragraph of the History section:

Change from:

In 1973 Eli N. Evans wrote in The Provincials that "For decades McGehee has been the institution by which the elite in New Orleans shield their young women from the blacks, the Jews, the poor, and the different, protecting them from ideas and associations that might lure them from their manifest destiny." Historically many graduates of McGehee matriculated to H. Sophie Newcomb Memorial College of Tulane University.

Change to:

According to Eli N. Evan’s 1973 autobiography The Provincials, in its early history McGehee was thought by some to be where the New Orleans “elite” sent their children to "shield" them from minorities. Historically many graduates of McGehee matriculated to H. Sophie Newcomb Memorial College of Tulane University.

Why? First, this statement has been twisted to make it seem like the author was writing about contemporary history in 1973. In fact, he was writing about the school’s early history.209. I clarified that. Second, direct quotes should be used for attributed subjective statements, such as opinions, only when important. Statements of fact, by contrast, should be summarized by Wikipedia. MOS: QUOTE. I’ve done that. Per WP:WPSCH/AG#WNTI, and WP:NPOV, articles about schools should be written from a neutral point of view. This extended quote is not neutral, which makes sense given the book is not written by a historian. The book is described by its publisher as “autobiography, storytelling, and interpretive history” [1]. And Evans is described by the publisher as an author writing an autobiography, not a professional historian. An autobiography should be treated as WP:Primary, and used only with great care. I’ve made the language as neutral and straightforward as possible, removing subjective interpretation and language.

2. Please delete the “Culture and student body” section and its contents, moving a paraphrase to History.

“Culture and student body”

In 1973 Evans, described the school as "[t]he debutante West Point, the playing fields of Eton, the New Orleans version of Choate-Chapin-Cordon Bleu all rolled into one". Evans had interviewed an ex-teacher, who described McGehee students as "steel butterflies" who had strong work ethics and who were dominant in relationships despite projecting images of "helpless femininity".

As of 1973, the school ensured the design of each graduation dress was different.

Change to and move just the first sentence to History, as the new second paragraph.

In 1973 Evans, described the school as "[t]he debutante West Point, the playing fields of Eton, the New Orleans version of Choate-Chapin-Cordon Bleu all rolled into one".

Why?

WP:Good articles about schools (x y z), use the sections about culture and student body to describe the present day make-up of a school. But as written, this entire section references the early history of the school as described in a single source: a 1973 book which is described by its publisher as “autobiography, storytelling, and interpretive history” by an individual author [2]. So it is wildly out of date and should not be presented as reflective of the school’s current culture or student body.

Some of the content is also problematic under Wikipedia policy, but the first sentence could be moved to History. The second sentence is a statement of opinion that cannot even be attributed to a named person, so should be removed under WP:PRIMARY. An autobiography with “interpretive history” is inherently subjective. As such, the source is WP:PRIMARY and should be used with great care, especially when the author is writing about subjects other than himself .

The information about graduation dresses in the 1960s and 70s is just too minor a detail to include.

Thank you for reviewing these requests. Geneclara (talk) 18:13, 1 August 2025 (UTC)

@Geneclara: Hi! Thank you for writing this! I took your paraphrasing of the Evans quote from 1973 about shielding, but I made a slight tweak, as Evans himself made the declaration rather than saying that some other people said it. A person commenting on McGehee doesn't have to be a professional historian; it could be an author of a published book, or a regular newspaper journalist, for example. Nonetheless, I made the edit because summarizing information is good over using direct quotes when possible. I'll look at some of the other proposed changes.

What would really help the article is finding articles in The Times-Picayune written about the school over the years. Has that publication written extensive articles covering the school and its culture, especially since the year 1970?

WhisperToMe (talk) 21:05, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

As for the second set about the school culture, I installed a template outright saying that the content reflects up to the 1970s and is out of date. Depending on whether such Times-Picayune articles are found, one could add content about post-1970s culture, or one could pare down the content and merge into the history section. WhisperToMe (talk) 21:18, 4 August 2025 (UTC)

I went ahead and did the second set of edits too. I recommend finding Times-Picayune pieces post-1970 that could be used to expand content on the school. I'm thinking I can add back some 1970s details if more details from subsequent decades sourced from the Times-Picayune are added. WhisperToMe (talk) 21:33, 4 August 2025 (UTC)